<The 2008 IEA WEO - The World Energy Model and Energy Demand The Oil Drum DrumBeat: November 14, 2008>

124 comments on Breaking News: EPA Ruling - Coal Plants Must Limit CO2?

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majorian on November 13, 2008 - 7:05pm Permalink | Subthread | Comments top

Glorious news,
This is the total defeat of the lying, GW denying, lobbyist-infested Bush-Cheney EPA.
The technology has worked for years but utilities are fighting it tooth and nail. There goes thousands of plans for new ultracritical steam cycle plants they've been drooling over. IGCC-CCS will be the standard design and they'll just have to swallow the 25% premium for capturing and burying the CO2.
Coal is no longer cheap energy!
Get used to it!

Unfortunately this seems to only apply to new coal plants.
Obama needs to have this apply to ALL coal plants.

This is the EASIEST way to reduce carbon emissions(~30% of all US GHG emissions are from coal fueled electricity).

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Jason Bradford on November 13, 2008 - 7:21pm Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

I am somewhat stunned that the EPA folks had the courage to do this. They have been such lackeys for so many years. Maybe with the election of Obama they didn't fear internal retribution from on high?

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geek7 on November 13, 2008 - 9:42pm Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

The EPA position has been, since the Reagan era, that since CO2 is naturally occurring in the atmosphere, it is NOT a pollutant. It has been a marvelously Jesuitical position. I don't think courage is involve. They are afraid of Obama and the people he will bring with him.

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thomas deplume on November 14, 2008 - 7:04pm Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

CO2 is like vitamin A. Not enough and you die. Too much and you die. But within a certain range all is well. We are already above the level of the healthy range (300-350 ppm).

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Will Stewart on November 14, 2008 - 7:47am Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

I am somewhat stunned that the EPA folks had the courage to do this.

It's likely a ploy to launch industry-favored legislation to blunt more widesweeping rules that the Obama Administration would seek to implement. The industry next year would cry "You're already over-regulating us, what are you trying to do; kill jobs??" I see no other motivation from the Bush Administration, given their rush to set anti-environmental policy on a whole host of issues, including less regulation on coal mountaintop extraction.

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oelewapperke on November 14, 2008 - 8:51am Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

Of course they would have a point if they said that.

To be honest the constant "alarm, alarm, alarm, it's already too late !" articles are progressing in turning the entire population against any global warming policies. If those policies start costing jobs (and how can you possibly avoid that ?) everyone, including Obama (perhaps especially Obama, he's a demagogue, and will not go against what people are calling for), will start crying to relieve the opressive co2 legislation.

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elwoodelmore on November 14, 2008 - 9:46am Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

and what special powers do you have to read the mind of obama and the future of legislation ?

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Cyril R. on November 14, 2008 - 9:58am Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

He's pulling your leg. Obviously you don't speak Dutch/Flammish. Oelewapper power of course!:

http://www.woordvandedag.nl/Woord.aspx/Oelewapper

oe·le·wap·per
1 [pej.] waardeloos persoon => sufferd

= Useless person, idiot, moron. Well chosen name.

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thomas deplume on November 14, 2008 - 7:07pm Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

Environmental laws can create jobs building the equipment that cleans the air.

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Koyaanisquatsi on November 14, 2008 - 5:04pm Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

I'm not excited at all about "clean coal". All it does is address the pollution created at the power plant, the greenhouse gasses.

As I understand it, to sequester the CO2, you have to first take the intake air, remove the oxygen from it to use for combustion, use that to burn the coal, then pressurize and cool the resulting exhaust and pump it far underground into some porous rock that will require more pressure every day as it constantly is filling up. To do this, even assuming there is a viable underground formation to take the CO2, (good luck there), requires approximately 33% of the energy output of the plant. That requires the plant to be 50% bigger than it would have been without sequestration and burn 50% more coal, for the entire life of the plant.

50% more coal used means 50% more strip mines, 50% more leveled mountains, 50% more water pollution, etc.

This is progress?

I say we need to move to truly clean technologies. This is not one of them, despite how much spin it's promoters want to give it.

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124 comments on Breaking News: EPA Ruling - Coal Plants Must Limit CO2?

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