The Oil Drum | How do these people sleep at night?

56 comments on How do these people sleep at night?

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Joao Carlos on December 8, 2005 - 11:02am

StoneDog wrote:

"What action will be more helpful in Global Warming, Kyoto supporting governments failed reductions or Bush's billions in research?"

maybe you want say "[...] or Bush's billions in invading Iraq?"

Bush is not using billions dollars to fund research to HOW eliminate Global Warming, he is funding research to prove that there is NO Global Warming. My guess that he will be less sucessfull than invading Iraq, but I am sure that he will say "Mission Acomplished" and say that there is no scientific proof that there is Global Warming. By the way he will give more billion dollars to petro and coal industry.

I am from Brazil and I think you discussion is funny because you ever blame that Kyoto is not working because the third world don't want help to low the global Warming. Let's see: you from developed countries where industrialized first, you had all 19th and half 20th century throwing carbon at the atmosfere before industrialization started at the third world, but now you want we stop industrialization (while you continue to be industriazed, see you) to stop the Global Warming that YOU CAUSED!!!!!

Sorry, but I need say it: It will be a happy day when the dollar finally crunsh and the USA go down the role. You deserve it...

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Sunlight on December 8, 2005 - 8:55pm

Well, well. As a US Citizen I am not particularly proud of much of our behavior towards Latin America -- or the Bush Administration policy on peak oil or global warming for that matter. Having said that allow me to make two points.

Most Americans did not vote for Bush in 2000 -- and given the facts that are now coming out regarding rigged voting machines, it is at least possible that most of us did not vote for him in 2004, either.
If you take America down you will in effect set up China in our place. A country that under Mao murdered at least 20 million of its own citizens, and will stop at nothing to gain a global domination that will make American hegemony look like a picnic. A country that doesn't care at all for human rights, even part of the time. A country that will steal the intellectual property of others (including the very innovative work you Brazilians are doing on the environment) and make sure that you receive as little profit on it as possible.

Without trying to lecture Latin Americans (again!) you might just be careful about what you wish for, in case you get it.

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StoneDog on December 8, 2005 - 10:44pm

It probably felt good to let me have it but I probably agree with your views on Global Warming. Kyoto is hopeless Annex 1 countries have reduced emissions by 1,089.90 Tg CO2 Equiv.

Sounds OK until you remove the basicly free reductions of 2,494.63 from the FSU leaving the remaining Annex 1 countries with an Increase of 1,404.73.

China a Non-Annex 1 country has had a net increase of around 640 Tg over the same period. If the US had joined Kyoto and met it's requirements it would only have resulted in a reduction of 302.76 Tg.

We, as in the world, can't even meet these relatively insignificant reductions let alone the 60%+ required to effect change.

I wouldn't wish for a fall in America because it would hurt the rest of the world and enthrone China. No matter how much people, including Americans, like to blame "Bush" for both climate and energy problems "We the People" are ultimately at fault.

From my perspective Human Nature will not allow any of us to overcome these problems before they slap us in the face. Peak Oil and Climate Change both require massive changes in behavior by entire populations...... Don't hold your breath.

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