260 comments on The Specter of Recession
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Following are some fascinating numbers from the Oil & Gas Journal showing the year over year decline, 2004 to 2005, in EU energy production, in terms of oil equivalent. The EU showed no increase in consumption, but because of falling domestic production, imports as a percentage of consumption increased.
Energy importers want to import domestic consumption less production. Even in areas with no increase in consumption, such as the EU, the import demand is increasing.
Energy exports can export domestic production less consumption. By and large, this export number is shrinking, because of the twin effects of flat to falling production and (in many cases) rapidly rising domestic consumption.
Rate of change in EU energy production, 2004 to 2005:
Crude oil production, -9%;
Gas production, -5.8%;
Coal, -5.7%;
Nuclear, -1.3%.
2005 total energy consumption per capita (Tonnes of Oil Equivalent, TOE):
EU, 3.6 TOE
Japan, 4.1 TOE
US, 7.8 TOE
I think that the conversion factor is about 7.3 barrels/tonne.
One of the "benefits" of a recession is lower prices. However, in a Post-Peak Oil world, that will only partially apply to energy, since we are likely to only see a demand respone and not a (net positive) supply response.
The problem that we face here in the US is our very high per capita energy consumption,and it will be very difficult to change. By and large, we live in large houses, long distances from work. Europeans by and large tend to live in smaller housing closer to work (or along mass transit lines).
Here in the US, we are colletively headed toward a cliff in our H2 Hummer, and the prevailing message from the "Iron Triangle" is to push the accelerator to the floor.
I do think that we are facing strong deflationary headwinds as Americans try desperately to unload highly leveraged assets.
Yergin's prediction was that rising production would force oil prices to come down to equalize supply and demand. The opposite has happened. Flat to falling production has forced oil prices up to equalize suppply and demand. Yet, the MSM still trots old Dan out on a regular basis.
http://www.mylinuxisp.com/~blawrence/CERA-Oct-06.pdf
I love some of the posts today, but this is my favorite:
In other words, the author asserts that Peak Oil is being undermined by an alleged oversupply of about 0.5 mbpd, which is about 0.6% of total liquids production, at a time when even ExxonMobil estimates that existing wellbores are declining at up to 5 mbpd per year.
In addition, we have credible evidence that the four largest producing oil fields in the world are declining or crashing, with steadily rising water cuts.
You know what the difference is between the per capita energy consumption in the EU and Japan (average of about 3.9 TOE per year) versus 7.8 for the US? It's the discretionary fluff here in the US. It's the majority of Americans driving to and from work who derive their paycheck from the discretionary side of the economy.
Let me be blunt. The majority of jobs in this country are not necessary. The Europeans live the way we should live, in smaller housing, close to work or along mass transit lines--using half of the per capita energy that Americans use.
I think that so many Americans are reacting so strongly (and irrationally) to the slightest signs that Peak Oil may not be real because they realize, at some basic level, that our imaginary economy--and our high per capita energy consumption--are doomed.
Let me put this is the most basic terms. You need to produce or perish. Jobs in discretionary sectors are going to be targeted for destruction by natural selection.
I am beginning to believe that Matt Savinar is right. As someone said, it is pointless to try to get someone to understand something when their income depends on them not understanding what you are saying.
We have largely become prostitutes to one another
Don't know if this is true, BUT check out this blog where a las Vegas mortgage broker is offering prostitution to close loans.
Hmmm...I'll let you guys tear this one up....
http://blog.lewrockwell.com/lewrw/archives/011473.html
Hey, I'm just here to help.
I can hear it now..........
Honey? whats this $200 service fee?
And why is she smiling?
I prefer to think of it in terms of artist/patron relationships.
That's my social model of choice : we should all be artists in some way, and appreciative consumers of all manner of art, whether it be haircuts, good coffee, street theatre... Work is overrated. You need to do it (and to produce stuff), but not as much as you think you do.
Is there anything really wronmg with exchanging services between people and does anyone seriously think it is desirable to stop doing it?
If I follow this logic, it is OK if I make a shoe for you, but repairing it is prostitution?
Then, I guess manufacturing and airplane is good. But that airplane needs to be designed. So if one company both designs and builds the airplane it is OK, but if a separate company provides the design as a service it is now terrible?
The distinction between goods and services is to a large degree meaningless and arbitrary.
I used to build houses, now I work on a computer all day and am much better off for it. Does that make me the happy hooker?
If globalization is reduced in a post-peak world with reduced transportation, it will become more necessary for individual nations (or even regions within nations) to have mixed economies with some base level of production kept local. Services retain value, but only if there is some production on which they can act. Somebody has to make the shoes on which the repairman plies his trade. If it's too expensive to import them from China, they need to be produced locally.
It seems to me that the fears of American post-peak decline due to a lack of a manufacturing base are largely based on an understanding of this fact.
Depends whether the globalization component is considered a given.
i.e. if you assume that you're morally bound to buy any given commodity from the lowest bidder, then Europe and the USA are f*cked, quite frankly. On a level playing field, i.e. no tariffs or subsidies, someone else will produce food, clothes, steel, cars, electronics, just about everything in fact, cheaper than we can. So actual production will be minimal in an advanced, high wage, environmentally-correct, high-rental economy. This is the big trend we see.
Technological innovation can arguably make up a lot of the gradient; but only if the economy never matures. i.e. the Chinese won't need to buy Euro cars or US electronics for ever.
The exposure we have in a globalised economy becomes pretty frightening if there's a risk of a blow-up.
If, on the other hand, a given economic basin organises itself for a minimum of self-sufficience in strategic areas, then the potential for a sustainable productive economy becomes much greater. I am well aware that I'm speaking heresy here.
I had severe misgivings at seeing the Euro textile industry sacrificed on the altar of free trade. If they do it to agriculture, I'll be on the streets protesting it.
It depends on whether the manufacturing can be done with unskilled labor. Unskilled labor is the area where China, and Mexico, etc excels. There's still a fair amount of skilled manufacturing in OECD countries that is competitive.
Historically, when the big fields roll over, a region can't increase its production. As I have repeatedly said, we have abundant evidence that our biggest fields are headed downhill--thus the flat to declining production, despite new wells coming on line.
I agree. I think we are declining on old fields at 3% in spite of infilling. I am making this conclusion by estimates of 5.5 million barrels of new usable capacity added since October 2004.
Even though I have a fluff job from the perspective of post PO, I do have my Plan B in place and have for the last two years. I will milk what I can outta this employment while it lasts.
I've been looking for the best way to describe what I am seeing in my business world...the best word is "contraction".
You can see contraction everywhere...contraction of budgets, workforce, size of candy bars, support services, patience...we are all contracting down to what is the thing of core value...not the nice to haves.
I remember reading about a chess club (perhaps in NY in the thirties or something) where men sat all day in smoky rooms, playing chess and betting on their games. How did they make a living? Off each other... a certain number of them had real jobs, and as they were not full-time players, tended to be not as good as the others, thereby injecting enough money for everyone to subsist... A simplified model of a service economy.
Gee... just like Las Vegas,
Or ... Indian gaming casinos,
Or ... those who work for the State Lottery system and claim they bring something of value to our civilization.
I often wonder which ship I'd be on.
Obviously, the weak link is that some of the players have to have real jobs. If they don't, the whole thing collapses.
Similarly, we can't really all make a living doing each other's laundry. In the end, clean laundry in a luxury. Food, water, shelter, clothing...those are the necessities. Someone has to do real work to provide them. And I suspect more and more of us will be doing it ourselves, as we lose our ability to pay someone else to do it for us.
Yeah, that's some good stuff. When I saw that link I immediately thought about the quiet hurricane season. I wonder how big of a chunk not having any big destruction has taken out of the economy.
by Frederic Bastiat, 1850:
THAT is the loose thread that is currently undermineing your peak oil revalries.
I'll give you props for the excellent spin though, sir!
But to your point about current prices - supply and demand in the market at any one point in time are the biggest determiners of price, some would say the only determinants. That doesn't say anything about geological supply or long term demand. If you make the mistake of thinking that the current lull in prices demonstrates peak oil is false, than you are making the same mistake as those who think that recent high prices demonstrate that peak oil is true.
First thing I wrote was that not everyone here believes we are past peak. But you chose not to address that.
Second portion of my post specifically said "If you believe...." But you seemed to have ignored that, too.
Wasn't it you that made some smart ass remark about semantics elsewhere in this thread? You seem to be quite dogmatic in your attitude for someone who suggests that "at the very least cant be proven true at the present time." That's not exactly the kind of strong statement that I'd use to go around implying people are completely off base.
Which only makes it more likely that Dec 05 will remain the all-time production high. This would be neither a geological peak nor even a logistical peak, but simply an economic peak.
Think about it : if there is oversupply of oil at $75 or even $60, during a period of strong international economic growth, then when will there ever be demand for greater levels of production? If there is a US recession that lasts several years, gradually dragging other economies down from their current levels of growth, and simultaneously energy saving is imcreasing, and energy substitution kicks in, then it seems likely enough to me that the top of the world production curve will just never happen... that the demand plateau will extend for several years, until it hits the logistico-geological downslope of world production (which will have been pushed out at least a little way).
That's my rosy, best-case scenario. If it happens at a barrel price that is low enough to handicap oil-sands and coal-to-oil, but high enough to make large-scale solar viable, then that's even cooler. Here's to $60 oil!
And alistairC, thats VERY short sighted of you, as demand could always increase next year and we surprise our Deffeys December peak, makeing the entire issue a mute point. Poor stuart, all those graphs for nothing :P
Well, it could. But the smart money is on a US recession. And demand is currently flat or decreasing with a booming world economy. So you'll have to explain your scenario.
I have no religion as to whether the Saudis' production is in geological decline. But if so, this is an extraordinarily happy coincidence for them.
Sales of SUVs and light trucks are up in September. We here at TOD live in a completely opaque bubble, completely free of the real world perceptions and values of those outside the bubble. Al Gore said that dealing with global warming was a moral imperative. Can it be that people have still not gotten the message? Or if they have the message, they don't care. Must buy new shiny, gas guzzling vehicles. Price of gas is all that matters. If gas is down this month, I guess they figure it will be down for the life of their vehicles. Except when it goes up again, they will bitch like banshees.