121 comments on No conclusions, just the January numbers and some concern
Comments can no longer be added to this story.
| Show without comments | PDF version
121 comments on No conclusions, just the January numbers and some concern
Comments can no longer be added to this story.
| Show without comments | PDF version
Search The Oil Drum with Google
Support The Oil Drum
Recently on TOD:World
TOD:Campfire
TOD:Europe
- Peak Gold, Easier to Model than Peak Oil? - Part I
- Carbon Capture and Storage
- Oilwatch Monthly November 2009
TOD:Canada
- In this house, we obey the laws of thermodynamics!
- The Round-Up: October 24, 2008
- Compressed Air Energy Storage - How viable is it?
TOD:Australia/NZ
- International Energy Agency calls 'Peak' on OECD Oil Demand
- Australian Senate: Peak Oil motion defeated 31:6
- The Bullroarer - Friday 20th November 2009
TOD:Net Energy
Blogroll
Energy Sites
- The Coming Global Oil Crisis
- Die Off
- Dry Dipstick
- Energy Bulletin
- From the Wilderness
- Life After the Oil Crash
- Peak Oil Crisis
- Peak Oil News and Message Boards
- Powerswitch
- Rigzone
- Matthew Simmons
- Wolf at the Door
Environment & Sustainability Sites
- The Daily Green
- EcoGeek
- Eco Street
- Green Car Congress
- Green Options
- green.alltop.com
- Gristmill
- RealClimate
- Sustainablog
- Treehugger
- WorldChanging
Blogs
- Casaubon's Book
- Cleantech Blog
- Clusterf
k Nation (Jim Kunstler) - The Cost of Energy
- David Strahan
- Early Warning
- The Energy Blog
- European Tribune
- GraphOilology
- Health After Oil
- jeffvail.net
- Mobjectivist
- Peak Energy (Australia)
- Peak Energy (USA)
- R-Squared
- Resource Insights
Finance & Economics Blogs
- The Big Picture
- Calculated Risk
- The Crash Course
- Ecological Economics
- Econbrowser
- Environmental Economics
- Infectious Greed
- The Mess That Greenspan Made
- Mish's Global Economic Trend Analysis
Organizations
Peak Oil Primers
Beware email scams!
Beware email scams claiming to be from this site. We do not have any job openings. If anyone contacts you about a job at The Oil Drum, do not reply to them, and definitely do not give them any personal information or send them money. Read more here.
“Any coward can fight a battle when he's sure of winning, but give me the man who has pluck to fight when he's sure of losing. That's my way, sir; and there are many victories worse than a defeat.”
—George Eliot
User login
Contact
- Content: editors at theoildrum dot com
- Tech support: support at theoildrum dot com
Personnel
- Editors: Nate Hagens, Gail the Actuary, Prof. Goose
- DrumBeat Editor: Leanan
- Contributors: ace, Engineer-Poet, Heading Out, jeffvail, JoulesBurn, Sam Foucher, Robert Rapier
- TOD:Campfire: Glenn, Jason Bradford
- TOD:Europe: Chris Vernon, Euan Mearns, Francois Cellier, Jerome a Paris, Luís de Sousa, Rembrandt, Rune Likvern, Ugo Bardi
- TOD:Canada: benk, Libelle
- TOD:ANZ: Big Gav, Phil Hart, aeldric
- Emeritus: Stuart Staniford
- Technician: Super G
License
This work is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Share Alike 3.0 United States License.










GAIA Host Collective
Suppose that the rate of energy price increase / energy inflation is going to be at or above 15%. This means that energy prices double every 5 years or less. I think this means it is less than 5 years for the solar to reach economic/energy break even. After that, as energy prices continue to escalate, second and third payback come even faster.
With money so cheap now, and with knowledge of coming energy price escalations due to Peak, investing in a fixed cost energy system based on solar seems like a sure win. Everyone should be doing it!
What other technology has taken over 40 years from first invention to workable marketplace economics ? Dr. Benz to Model T, discovery of double helix in DNA to first GMO crop, E=MC2 to atomic bomb, elelctricity, etc. And we live in a much more technological world with better communications, etc. today. And still the future of PV (and fuel cells) is "tomorrow" as is was in 1974 when it was the savior then as well.
Too much time, too much R&D and too little to show for it. I have written off PV and embraced wind, hydro, geothermal and some biomass as the workable alternatives.
The electrical output starts declining as soon as they are used (rate is related to heat exposure I believe). Earlier models were at well less than half output in a typically application in 20 years. Don;t know about latest versions.
Still, not a permanent solution.
OK, photovoltaic cells are - for the time being - a more cost intensive energy source. I agree with you. However already today, where is no electric grid, it is already cheaper. Especially in these rural areas, many people still depend on kerosene lamps or generators for light or electricity.
Even energy predictions from companies like Shell show in 50 years a very large percentage of solar energy in use. Writing off is as far as I can tell much to early!
Solar Power for the Global Village
Jürgen Kleinwächter has developed a model for solar energy supply to an African village with 50 inhabitants, the "Solar Power Village". Without photo voltaic it produces energy for cooking, pumping water, wheat milling and electricity.
.
.
Under the roof of a 30-40 sqm sized green house - this size may not be adequate for European conditions - a row of fresnell lenses are mounted and follow the movement of the sun. The fresnell lenses focus the sunlight on a focal line. Exactly in this focal line vegetable oil flows in blackened copper tubes that are coated by transparent glass tubes. Kleinwächter: "Vegetable oil is available everywhere in the 3rd World. Here the oil serves as a carrier of heat. As the oil flows through the concentrated energy zone it heats up easily to 220°C."
The green house is covered by a special layer. This allows more parts of the sunlight spectrum (especially UV) to pass through than usual layers do - supporting the growth of vegetables underneath and making the layer last longer. "By the way, the vegetables are of a very good quality - you can not compare it with the usual products from green houses", Kleinwächter declares. "The temperature in the green house is as comfortable as a day in spring, and allows the growth of salad even in the summer."
The special layer belongs to the few parts of the Solar Village that can not be produced in regional work. From the green house the oil then flows into a heat storage.
http://www.nrel.gov/news/press/2005/1805_quantum_dot.html
the lead selenide quantum dots they are working with could theoretically acheive a 65% conversion rate. The best silicon cells are at 21.6% and use a positive ground. Roughly a factor of 3.
Dr. Nate Lewis of Caltech has been crunching the numbers with respect to quantities of primary fossil fuels, oil, gas and coal. He's compared various alternatives and what they would mean to area useage such as the area to grow ethanol from corn to replace all 3 types of fossil fuels. Around 57 minutes in, he calculates how much PV it would take to replace all three. Interested? Here's the URL:
http://online.itp.ucsb.edu/online/colloq/lewis1/
I calculated that I could carpool, on average, 30 miles round trip every other day and power the trip using PV from my roof.