The Oil Drum | DrumBeat: August 11, 2006

242 comments on DrumBeat: August 11, 2006

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tate423 on August 11, 2006 - 9:39am

I know we beat the hell out of GM but I think it's well deserved. Nice to know they're bringing back a car that just 4 years ago didn't sell, oh and it will be available in 09 probably.

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&a mp;cid=1155246610543&call_pageid=968350072197&col=969048863851

"Oil prices will likely stay in the $65 (U.S.) a barrel range for the next year or so," said Carlos Gomes, senior economist and auto industry specialist at Scotiabank. "I think it will be somewhat of a head wind for the muscle car segment."
"Camaro is much more than a car," he said. "It symbolizes America's spirit and its love affair with the automobile."
Insiders say the Camaro could be a "halo car" that would help attract customers to other GM models and boost overall sales.
"In that way, it could be very significant for GM," said DesRosiers.

They're going to turn it around with this don't you think?

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tstreet on August 11, 2006 - 10:16am

America needs to fall in love with something else, like trains, for example.

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fleam on August 11, 2006 - 4:21pm

America needs to fall in love with her own two feet ..... oops haven't seem them in a while!

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Mad Maxout on August 12, 2006 - 10:15am

Orthopaedic surgeons stand to make a lot of money if Americans decide on running as a commuting method. After all, a mile of running is a mile's worth of bodily wear and tear. Those miles really do add up. I already have a blown left knee from a lifetime of high-speed walking. Ny right leg, which is now favoured is showing its wear and tear with a seemingly permanent pulled muscle. It's a trade off, Do you give your money to a cardiologist or the orthopaedic surgeon as you shred your lower body?

While people in Kenya might have evolved to run marathon-like distances to commute, European type white people have not. That's why we invented cars in the first place. When a runner-commuter can no longer commute what are they supposed to do? Blow themselves up like a Palastinian? When cars are too costly to use, that's what public transit or motorbikes are for. When that gets too expensive, the bicycle will be the method of choice. But something like running 10 miles each way is all but out of the question due to bodily wear and tear. Sure, you'll lose weight that way, but the mileage on the lower body is not worth it. Are you ready to shred your legs to commute?

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Nagorak on August 13, 2006 - 3:42am

I doubt evolution has much to do with it, it's a result of lifestyle and not being accustomed to it. We've only been developing alternatives to walking for a short period of our history. It's not long enough that we could have evolved away from being able to walk/run. When people get older they naturally have problems. It's not just reserved for Europeans by any means.

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Nagorak on August 13, 2006 - 3:42am

Not to mention: why would we go back to walking? I'm pretty sure a bicycle would still work just fine, and it's probably better for traveling long distances.

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PeakOil Tarzan on August 11, 2006 - 10:25am

Detroit seems resigned to producing "nostalgia toys" for middle-aged men with a few bucks to blow. My advice would be to package these things with 8-track tape players, a color-coordinated pot pipe that slips neatly into a slot in the ash tray, and an inflatable "girlfriend" complete with hip-hugger jeans and long, bandana-bound blond hair.

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prole on August 11, 2006 - 10:52am

Inflatable "girlfriend" is so 70s.

Let's offer the soft-sided middle-agers the new and improved Sony Sex Machine that never says no.

One way to reduce the population as these noobs crash and burn in ecstasy.

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Prodigal Son on August 11, 2006 - 12:09pm

That's so funny -- and so true. Nothing says 'peaked in high-school' like a Camaro.

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tate423 on August 11, 2006 - 1:48pm

My senior year I had a 97 Z28 slightly used but FULLY loaded, but an automatic. Following high school I dumped it for a brand new hyundai tiburon with the 5 speed. College was a bit farther drive than high school. There were only like 3 cars that could beat that small block V8. It WAS fun though.

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Mad Maxout on August 12, 2006 - 10:50am

I greatly prefer the Automatic over the Stick. I tried a Stick, but I'm not co-ordinated enough to use it. The Automatic nicely allows for the "just sit back and fly" type driving expierence. Since motorcycles have a "Stick" my poor coordination sank that try. :( The first gear is awful herky-jerky! So long as a vehicle has the Automatic (or if it's a jet) I'll gladly drive it.

The trick of The Stick is that while it will give better fuel economy, it takes some coordination on the part of the user. The Stick was invented becuse the internal combustion engine runs best at one RPM speed but a car must be able to go from zero to a desired speed. The electric motor is a lot better match than the car engine. The innovation with the hybrid comes with how the controls are like a normal car with an Automatic. Previous attempts were always with extra switches or the like that'll require the new owner having to learn them, like that Stick.

The thing about the Stick I don't like is the bit with having to do the clutch. The Automatic has that "fluid clutch" thingy which causes it to act like the case of boating. Step on the gas, and you get the desired thrust. Step off, and you glide. A zillion times easier than messing with a clutch and a hand on the gear shift! I would end up preferring a British side drive car in the case of having to do a Stick instead of an American side drive Stick car. That's becuse I drive with my right hand on the teering column.

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odograph on August 11, 2006 - 11:07am

I had a '95 Camaro, 275 HP, 325 LB torque, 6 speed stick. It was fun, and scary fast. I remember saying to the salesperson that I didn't dream in my 70's high school days that I'd be able to buy a big V8 20 years later. The future seemed different back then. I guess, in retrospect, mid-90's gas prices lulled me into thinking they had found more oil after all.

Interesting that they finally went with an independent rear suspension on the whole Camaro line. The solid axle would stick pretty good on smooth surfaces, but hit a pot-hole near limits of adhesion ...

Anyway, on the other side of the coin,

GM, Daimler, BMW Will Spend $1 Billion on Hybrids

I think they want to sell a few more Camaros to the poor dumb SOBs (like me) who think they had found more oil after all ... when they wise up, maybe they'll have hybrids.

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PeakOil Tarzan on August 11, 2006 - 11:24am

odograph, we've all been there. When I recall the nights I spent pointlessly tooling around town burning GTO (gas, tires, and oil) like there was no tomorrow, I feel my facial muscles draw up in an involuntary grimace. Good thing we grew up, eh? Hope it wasn't too late:-)

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odograph on August 11, 2006 - 11:35am

I spun my touring bicycle (w/ nobbies and panier) up to 22 mph (22 mph!) to pass some kids last week. Funny how you can get the speed outlet in the 20 mph range, and do the body some good.

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Siggi on August 11, 2006 - 11:42am

You might like to have a look at
http://www.swizzbee.ch/

Especially if you live in a hilly region.

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PeakOil Tarzan on August 11, 2006 - 11:54am

odograph, I've been doing the same. A couple of years back, I dusted off my trusty Shogun touring bike and now bike to work as often as I can. It's a great way to fend off old age. I highly recommend it.

Siggi, that looks pretty good. Do you think I could add an auxillary seat to accomodate my inflatable "girlfriend?"

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Siggi on August 11, 2006 - 12:14pm

Hmm, I am afraid she might fly away.

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pedex on August 11, 2006 - 12:15pm

my work bike, it sees about 15,000 miles a year

http://home.columbus.rr.com/pedex/000_0110.jpg

pretty typical of what us messengers ride these days, just meat and potatoes, its all business

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odograph on August 11, 2006 - 12:24pm

A fixie! I don't think I could do it .. old dog, new tricks.

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pedex on August 11, 2006 - 12:27pm

actually its both fixed or singlespeed with a freewheel, just flip the rear wheel around

at 40 yrs old im the oldest guy here still slinging packages

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PeakOil Tarzan on August 11, 2006 - 12:45pm

Pretty neat! I had read something recently about messengers preferring singlespeeds. Seems a good choice in town but much of my commute is over hilly terrain.

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pedex on August 11, 2006 - 7:37pm

Well, once youve been riding regularly for quite awhile gears really dont help much cept for racing, I just got back from watching the state criterium championships here, put in about 65 miles today on that bike. Unless the hills are over like 12% and/or more than about 2-3 miles long its really no big deal.

The reason we like bikes like that is its harder to break something, although stuff still breaks, just not as often as with a geared race bike.

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Substrate on August 12, 2006 - 12:06am

"Unless the hills are over like 12% and-or more than about 2-3 miles long its really no big deal."

Got that, the other, and both at the same time. Plus the real beauty...gravel roads. So I require both a decent set of gears and fat tires.

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Mad Maxout on August 12, 2006 - 10:56am

Those damn bike messengers. I once had one damn near run me over in downtown Chicago. They sure get crazy! You'll have to be pretty crazy to take up that job, so the rest of us have to give them credit, since it's due. Better to be almost run over by a bike messenger than some idiot yuppie's horse-sized dog.

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fleam on August 11, 2006 - 4:23pm

Sweet ride Pedex!! Everything that should be there, nothing that shouldn't.

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djwolf on August 11, 2006 - 12:36pm

Amusing... I still have a '95 Camaro. I drive it about 500 miles a year and it still gets 27 mpg. No more cruising in this car, it's lucky to make it to hardware store with the amount it's driven.

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Mad Maxout on August 12, 2006 - 9:50am

GM will turn it around, when the Cubs win a World Series. For nearly a decade, I have asked Cubs fans this question:

Which will happen first? The end of global civilisation? Or the Cubs winning a World Series?

My bet is the collapse of civilisation first, with 1908 being the last time ever for a Cubs World Series success. The above question is a no-brainer for any peaknik. Some time down the road, Wrigley Field will be a ruin like the Roman football stadium in the middle of Roma. And the Cubs will still be without a championship like the White Sox have before the "end of days".

Just a fun fact for the doomers in the TOD crowd. :)

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242 comments on DrumBeat: August 11, 2006

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“If kindness and comfort are, as I suspect, the results of an energy surplus, then, as the supply contracts, we could be expected to start fighting once again like cats in a sack.”

—George Monbiot