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157 comments on DrumBeat: October 15, 2006

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Johnny Buffalkill on October 15, 2006 - 11:35am Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top
I work in the biotech industry, which has really heavy Chinese representation, so I know quite a few people from China, most of whom are highly educated (Master's or PhDs), and my experience is that they are no more peak oil aware than Americans.  To be fair, my aquaintances might be a skewed group though.  In the biotech industry, it is almost heresy to think that biotechnology can't completely replace petroleum.  Also, being educated, many of these people have probably been a bit sheltered from some of the hardships common in China, and sheltering seems to numb vigilance.  But still, I have yet to meet a Chinese person who has any concern about energy depletion.
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Virtual Ipecac on October 15, 2006 - 11:56am Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top
I do hope that biotech can help with the transition to other fuels.  I know there are some great minds at work in that industry.

I knew some Chinese students in graduate school and even though they were over here, they were very guarded in their conversations that could any way be misconstrued as critical of the Chinese governement.  I believe they felt like they were monitored over here and it was not safe to speak freely.

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Bitteroldcoot on October 15, 2006 - 1:03pm Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top
I've had similar experiences.  They are afraid of saying anything political.

I knew a guy in grad school who actually lived thought the cultural revolution.  I managed to get him talking about it one day.   Evidently it was a pretty horrible experience, he could look me in they eye and his voice kept trembling.

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Franz on October 15, 2006 - 8:05pm Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top
Perhaps you only think they were afraid of saying anything political. Maybe they just didn't give a stuff.

I recently spoke to a Chinese academic from Beijing while she was on a visit to Hong Kong. I kept away from politcal topics, thinking the way you do. But then she just brought up the Tiananmen Massacre herself, as she was within earshot of it at the time that it happened. She talked about it for a while and then she said that times had changed, and that the current generation of Chinese students had little political consciousness and were only interested in material advancement.

Maybe you are not seeing fear when you talk politics with your Chinese associates: you are seeing ignorance. The 'fear' shows up because they are scared of appearing dumb by having nothing of interest to use in their reply to what you say.

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geewiz on October 16, 2006 - 1:12am Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top
scary! was it not Pol Pot in Cambodia who wanted to keep the people ignorant?
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fleam on October 16, 2006 - 2:56am Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top
Pol Pot distrusted anyone who was "learned" - he wanted to create a new society from the ground up, wanted some real clean slates to start with. That meant the young and the dumb. If you had the little marks on your nose from wearing glasses, look out! If you were studying to get a job with the Post Office, don't tell the authorities that, tell them you've always moved trash cans for a living. Co-workers who'd been in Pol Pot's camps told me these last things.
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Franz on October 16, 2006 - 9:51am Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top
Okay, call me irony-challenged, but what I meant was that (even educated) people in so-called 'totalitarian' (worthless term) states can be genuinely ignorant of or uninterested in certain issues without that being directly the fault or even the intention of 'Big Brother' ... the same goes for people in the 'free world' (pffft) too, and to the same extent. Most people don't know or care about big issues because they have other things to attend to. Or as the great critic John Berger put it, 'Capitalism survives by compelling ordinary people, whom it exploits, to construe their own interests as narrowly as possible.'(And China is capitalist, all misconceptions to the contrary. They have Hooters in Shanghai, for heaven's sake). True, it is 'scary', but it's the market that's done it, not the CCP.
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ThatsItImout on October 16, 2006 - 4:20am Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

"The 'fear' shows up because they are scared of appearing dumb by having nothing of interest to use in their reply to what you say."

Someone please tell them that "appearing dumb" has never stopped any of us here!  :-)

Roger Conner  known to you as ThatsItImout

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mh497 on October 16, 2006 - 5:44pm Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top
Nope, it's actually fear.
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