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GAIA Host Collective
Low energy TV delayed
Surface-conduction electron-emitter displays, or SEDs have about half the power use of LCDs (which use significantly less than cathode ray TVs). Of course, the prime target market is 55" screens.
I wonder how much a more "human scale" 25" or 28" screen would use; or a "get by" 13" ? Perhaps 10 or 12 watts ?
http://yahoo.businessweek.com/globalbiz/content/jan2007/gb20070108_91314...
An essential part of the non-negotiable 'American Way of Life" that CAN be saved by the "Just-In-Time Technology Fairy" (tm) (Made in Japan). If we cannot drive, we can at least sit at home and watch a screen.
Best Hopes,
Alan
I wonder if we could run our electrified railroads off the power savings from SEDs ?
Perhaps tax every other form of television EXCEPT SED 28" screen or smaller. Large screens (including SEDs) get a luxury tax (increases with size, small tax for 32" or 35", thousands for 55"+), all types except SEDs get a "energy waste tax" (varies by power wasted, CRTs taxed more, LCDs taxed less) and we give a tax credit for buying a medium or small screen SED for several years to speed the transition.
Less waste heat from the TV means less air conditioning needed.
IMVHO (back of envelope) SED TVs + more compact fluorescents could save enough to run the current railroads PLUS a large % of heavy truck inter-city freight. SEDs alone might run the main lines today.
Best Hopes,
Alan
This may be something TPTB are working on much harder than we realized.
Case in point: A few years ago in a large apartment building I'm living in, the power goes out. It's dark, it's still early evening, nuthin' much to do, no TV to watch, so.... people get their flashlights and glowsticks and a few have candles, and start getting together and talking. Little groups form, and start getting to know each other. Oh, I live here, Wow, you're right around the corner from me, Hey, I've seen you in the parking garage, you have that so and such car right? Remember that time in the library... etc.
If it stays out, for a few days, sure you get some pissed off people, but the main thing is you end up with these social networks that have formed. You may have people realizing how much time they waste watching TV and sitting around, you may end up with, after time, if these social networks are not snuffed out, POLITICAL DISCUSSIONS.
However, in the case I saw, after a few hours the lights came back on and we went back to our TVs and not knowing each other and never saying Hi or making eye contact. We went back to being good Americans.
It may however be harder to keep people good Americans, not knowing and not trusting their neighbors, if those darned TVs keep fritzing out everytime the power goes out - which will only happing more often in our decaying Empire.
Hence, the low-power TV. We may see TVs that can run off of the UPS you may already have for your computer, TVs that can run off of a car batt, TVs that can run day/night off of a $100 solar cell array like they sell at Fry's, charging during the day.
We may see much more effort and exotic materials put into this than there would be otherwise, because TVs give TPTB that valuable social control.
Hi fleam,
I like your story. You may be interested in these folks: http://www.tvturnoff.org/. They used to be called "TV Free America", which I liked a lot better. Then they changed their name. Still, maybe check them out. "Live free - turnoff TV".
I really enjoy TV-free life myself. As one of my neighbors used to say "I may not accomplish anything in my life, but when I look back, I'll say - 'At least I didn't spend it watching TV'"
When you write:
"However, in the case I saw, after a few hours the lights came back on and we went back to our TVs and not knowing each other and never saying Hi or making eye contact."
I wonder what it would take for someone to make these kind of get togethers something that happens...?
One 19-inch TFT-LCD computer monitor I measured a while back took about 20W. (A 19 inch CRT might take around 80W and typically has a slightly smaller useful screen area.) One thing we'll have to see is how long an 'SED' actually lasts, since manufacturing cost/energy may well dominate. After all, if that TFT-LCD lasts 20,000 hours (10 years active business use, one shift), and it uses 20W, it will only use 400kwh over all that time, which might be $40 in electricity at retail rates, or $15 at wholesale rates. I suspect it takes more than that to make it, but anything more than a guesstimate is probably proprietary information.
Unfortunately, just a week or two of driving, even in the most efficient vehicle, is likely to use more than 400kwh. So if it turns out that we cannot - or do not wish to - or let the NIMBYs and BANANAs run the whole show as in the Case of Ted Kennedy and the Wind Farm - build enough of something to have reasonably abundant energy supplies in the future, then, yes, indeed, we will be sitting at home watching screens. This should shock no one - before energy became abundant, most people could do little but sit home, once they were done with the day's enormously hard labor. And the hard reality is that only dead people have zero environmental impact.
I am pro-NIMBY and pro-BANANA. Humans have already destroyed & polluted too much of this world. Humans need to learn to live without cars and television sets and consumer goods. Humans probably ought to learn to adapt to their own local environment, too, rather than using climate control to maintain a "perfect" temperature suitable for the comforts of the obese & lazy.
David Mathews
http://www.geocities.com/dmathew1
What happened to the flag system that was announced the other day? I can't wait.
Sorry David, but I would rather watch paint dry than read your rubbish. That was not hyperbole.
Hello pickyreader,
I am so saddened to hear you say that, pickyreader. Then again, it is altogether possible that I simply don't care about your opinions.
Have you considered that possibility?
David Mathews
http://www.geocities.com/dmathew1
If you simply did not care, you wouldn't be so saddened now, would you?
This deep thought message brought to you by:
Hothgor! Paid Troll Extraordinare!
Hello Hothgor,
That would mean ... I was not saddened. Thanks for the clarification, Hothgor.
I feel bad for anyone who actually reads every post on these threads. Such people ought to spend their time watching paint dry. There are really one about three different arguments which occur here on The Oil Drum on a regular (near-daily) basis, and after a week all the different views are fully expressed.
Anyone who reads all the posts on The Oil Drum really needs to find some sort of hobby ... like watching paint dry. I really do believe that most of the regular posters spend way too much time on The Oil Drum and way too much time thinking strictly about oil & mathematical models regarding oil.
There's more to life than this. Like watching paint dry.
Hothgor, don't you have any other interests? Pursue them.
David Mathews
http://www.geocities.com/dmathew1
Hello Everyone,
Here's an Anderson Cooper news clip regarding the Niger Delta tragedy:
http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/scp_v3/viewer/index.php?pid=16598&rn=49750&...
Nigeria is undoubtedly a country which would have benefited were it governed by the principles of NIMBY and BANANA over the last several decades. The oil industry has made a horrendous mess out of the delta.
It is sad to think that those who have profited from these crimes are rewarded by our economy for their success.
David Mathews
http://www.geocities.com/dmathew1
dmathews you're mellowing out, and becoming much more readable.
However, as I've said before and will keep saying, much of this web site is all about How can be keep the Modern civilization party going?
Just coming right on out and saying that humans "hafta" learn to live without cars and TVs and live within Mother Nature's budget will make you about as popular as someone screaming on the sinking Titanic, "DO SOMETHING people, we're SINKING!"
dmathews is just too blunt in the way he says what he says.
but that doesn't mean what he says is wrong, just that people do not want to listen.
because what he represents is the reality that drastic changes are needed to at least minimally soften the blow reality is about to make on people.
or as someone posted here once.
you can't solve a problem with the same frame of mind that got you into the problem in the first place.
i am also against the 'flag' system.
whats to stop jack*&^^%'s like Hothgor from signing up multiple accounts then using them to flag people like west texas off the page?
don't think that will happen? it happens more then the people at slashdot like to admit.
That's why Slashdot has meta-moderation, where anyone can pop over and check a few comments' moderation for fairness. Not a perfect solution, but helps.
I had assumed that I would only be able control the people that I was able to ignore. This is not necessarily a good assumption.
If I had to choose who could flags other posters for me I would devise a weighting system where only the story contributors were able to set flags, and their flags would be multiplied by the number of articles that they have posted to TOD. Under that system, I would not want to get on Leanan's bad side!
Do you mean humans need to do without consumer goods like bread? Food is the ultimate consumer good because everybody uses it while not everyone uses electricity.
Hello Thomas,
I am in favor of bread but opposed to oil, electricity and technology. Consumers can keep their bread if they sacrifice all of these other things. But if the consumers sacrifice nothing they won't even have bread to eat.
David Mathews
http://www.geocities.com/dmathew1
BUT but but but but but ..... will people have to do without IPODS???? No CELL PHONES???
Somewhere on some deep level these are being seen as equivalent with bread. In fact, what yup eats bread any more? Isn't it pasta al dente and various scones and things?
You can really scare the bejeezuz out of people here flat-out saying that it will be bread and bicycles not ipods and solar-nano-fusion-heavywater-good-karma-powered-GreenPorsches and let the easy motorin' go on.......
Mr. Mathews,
Bread can't be produced without using technology like an oven, some form of plow, and at least harnesses for draft animals.
Your blanket statements against technology reveal a certain cognitive dissonance between your ears. You detest technology yet continue to berate us using the most sophisticated technology ever created. Be true to your beliefs and stop using up space on this discussion board.
Hello thomas deplume,
Individual sacrifices are not sufficient to solve this problem. This civilization needs to sacrifice its technological crutches or otherwise it will suffer the consequences. So I will speak to the civilization using the tools which make such communication possible.
David Mathews
http://www.geocities.com/dmathew1
What is a BANANA?
BANANA (an acronym of Build Absolutely Nothing Anywhere Near Anything or possibly Build Absolutely Nothing Anywhere Near Anyone) is a term most often used to criticize the ongoing opposition of certain interest groups to land development.
The apparent opposition of some activists to every instance of proposed development suggests that they seek a complete absence of new growth. Compare with acronym NIMBY, which describes development stymied by those who do not want the development in "their backyard".
The acronym was coined by Don Terner, President of affordable housing developer BRIDGE Housing of San Francisco, in 1990 or earlier. The term is also used within the context of planning in the UK. The Sunderland City Council lists the term on their online dictionary of jargon.
[edit] References
THANKS
Hello Conrad,
Exactly. This is why I am pro-BANANA. Get your oil industry off my planet!
David Mathews
http://www.geocities.com/dmathew1
FWIW, because of the licensing issue that was giving the SED venture problems, Toshiba recently sold all of its interests to its partner, Canon. So Canon now owns the whole venture. How this will play out is still unknown because SED is still more expensive manufacture, even if otherwise being preferable to other technologies.
SED is however an example of where we can continue to work on increase the efficiencies of many of the products that we use. I expect that over the next two decades much of what we use in daily life will be scrutinzed for energy improvements.