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182 comments on DrumBeat: August 2, 2007

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Darwinian on August 2, 2007 - 2:19pm Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

Theantidoomer, your math leaves a lot out. Are you saying he could heat his home, in Eastern Massachusetts, all night long, in the dead of winter with solar power? What kind of battery bank would he need to run all night, not to mention sometimes for weeks at a time when the sun does not shing?

Really, no one in Massachusetts heats with solar power, for very obvious reasons.

Ron Patterson, The Doomer ;-)

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theantidoomer on August 2, 2007 - 2:40pm Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

Ah Batteries you ask. This is where the NaS batteries added to the electric grid will come in:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium-sulfur_battery

http://blogs.spectrum.ieee.org/tech_talk/2007/07/sodiumsulfur_batteries_...

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Substrate on August 2, 2007 - 6:51pm Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

Hey! Wild and crazy idea...he could - BUY INSULATION! Caulk, weatherstripping, etc. I'm sure $5,000 worth would put a huge dent in that bill and pay for itself lickety split. Anyway, it's always said that you should spend your money on efficiency before you spend it on alternative energy because you get a bigger bang for your buck and then it's a lot easier (need a smaller system) to go alternative afterward.

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btu on August 2, 2007 - 8:45pm Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

Insulation and air sealing are the key my friends.

2005-2006 average July KWH electrical usage for my home (890 kwh), this July after adding insulation and weatherization and replacing the AC with a 17 SEER (517 kwh), and the summer has been warm in the Twin Cities.

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auntiegrav on August 2, 2007 - 4:20pm Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

Really, no one in Massachusetts heats with solar power, for very obvious reasons.

Yeah; they live in too big houses with inadequate insulation.
Cheaper to build a tiny winter house in the back yard than try to heat the stupid behemoth all winter. Or dig a hole and have a winter 'cave' with a greenhouse on top of it.
As for zoning, better to ask forgiveness than to ask permission, I think. The government will be broke, too, you know.

You can do a lot of shoveling and rock picking for 25 grand. Heat it with a catalytic pellet stove if that suits you, and grow some food and save money (or make money) with the greenhouse on top. We live in stupid houses. I've got one, and I'm planning to live the way the original farm builders did: close all the doors and only heat the kitchen.

Or build a cold fusion box. (www.infinite-energy.com)
I've got room for windmills, though, so that's also on the agenda.

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wizofaus on August 2, 2007 - 5:06pm Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

Why the need the heat the home all night long?
Wouldn't superinsulation be more than adequate to keep the temperature from dropping below "dangerously cold"? Personally I would much prefer to have the heating off at night - I sleep much better when it's cold, but the wife has a fit at that suggestion. Admittedly I live in a much milder climate than MA, but we also have lousy insulation: even so, on the coldest nights of the year (where it might hit 0C = 32F briefly) the indoor temperature would never drop below 10C with the heating off.

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PeakOil Tarzan on August 2, 2007 - 5:31pm Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

wizofaus, we keep the thermostats (5 zones) set at 55 F. On sunny days, when the outside air temperature is in the twenties, the house heats up nicely and with a bit of help from the woodstove, inside temps stay above 60. It's when the sun doesn't shine -- which, as Darwinian says, can be days at a time -- or when the outside temps are down in the single digits or even below 0 F, that the house really gets tough to heat. We are well-insulated but even so, inside temps will go well down into the fifties at night (and then, of course, the furnace kicks on). The other thing that I've learned is that once the house really cools off, it's pretty tough to warm back up.

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wizofaus on August 2, 2007 - 7:34pm Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

55F (~12.5C) is definitely quite low to set a thermostat...I assume you have it somewhat higher during the day?

Still, I remember watching something about houses in Sweden, which presumably gets just as cold as MA, that required no extra-energy inputs for heating. A combination of superinsulation and some sort of passive heat exchange system was enough to keep the temperature very comfortable all year around.

BTW, our natural gas bill is about $300 a year - which includes hot water heating and stovetop cooking. At that rate, extra insulation would take quite some time to pay itself off...but I'm still keen to have it done, if nothing else to allow the house to maintain a more consistent temperature.

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john macklin on August 2, 2007 - 6:36pm Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

It's called net metering, as long as you're connected to the grid. Check it and all incentives for any state or Fed at http://www.dsireusa.org/

Off-grid, you are correct and batteries will be required.

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Dryki on August 3, 2007 - 12:56am Permalink | Subthread | Parent | Comments top

Really, no one in Massachusetts heats with solar power, for very obvious reasons.

Wrong.

Passive solar, well-insulated buildings work just fine. No batteries required.

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