The future is the whole point. I suspect the reality is that oil and its alternatives will continue fill the needs and the market pricing will determine the speed of change if a sudden long term run up can be avoided.

I think Gail is right that the attention needs given to the import issue and the credit market problems ahead of "peak oil" idea.

I suspect that the credit marketers and the bankers will get into trouble and that they will look to the government to bail them out. It seems the Federal Reserve is doing that already and if it gets to congress we will be paying to save those skins for decades. See the http://newenergyandfuel.com/ review of this article on Oct 1 for more details. I bet we can't cleanly close up those creditors and get on with normal business and life.

Thanks for linking to your review of this article. It is titled Fun with Doom and Gloom.

I don't know why other folks aren't thinking through where all this could lead. We have gotten so used to imports and globalization, that we just assume they will continue in their current form forever.

The credit market has mushroomed to include all kinds of derivatives and securitized sliced and diced debt. It seems like the whole system needs to shrink to a small fraction of its current size.

Thanks for your article, Gail. I tend to see this as a motivator to get on with the future of more and better conserved oil and whatever alternatives can come and to get ready for the crash of the credit marketers without the citizens getting creamed by saving their skins. I think the economy could handle the credit crash or an enormous oil price spike independently but together they would be a world catastrophe, much as the article makes clear.

You are exactly right that the credit markets gone mushroom, a lot like an atom bombs cloud. It needs returned to reality and decent behavior, hopefully a sensible congress would address it but the twin risks of the lobbyists making things even worse or a regulatory framework that comes loaded against the consumer keep me from looking that way.

Let's just bankrupt them like anybody else. Then the survivors would learn something.

I don't know how useful it is, but I see the problem in two parts. There is a failure to reach the intellectual level, and there is a failure to reach the emotional level. We see these failures as CRABS, and the UNDEAD.

CRABS, the Classic Retarded American Blank Stare that you receive when you try to address these issues with those unfamiliar. The issues are complex, wide, and deep, and most people can't even begin to put what we try to convey into any personally relevant context.

And the UNDEAD, the Universally Neglected and Deceived, Empty of the American Dream. These people largely don't care about the serious issues because they are largely unable to care. After X number of years of being sold false promises and exaggerated claims about a bill of goods that included suburbia, upward mobility, and a prosperous future, or having been continually pushed down, ignored, and lied to on their attempts at climbing Mount Capitalism, they are now perpetually discouraged and unfeeling. These people would agree with George Carlin's observation, "It's called the American Dream, 'cause you have to be asleep to believe it."

Why aren't other people thinking things through thoroughly? The issues are extremely complex and people don't take the time, or they have scant energy left to care about anything except getting through today.

And I think the way to address this problem is counter-intuitive.

How do you get people who don't care, to care? How do you get people who don't think enough, to think enough? By addressing their weak spots, the counter-intuitive part. The person who doesn't care has weak spots in how they think that can be addressed. The person who doesn't think enough has weak spots in how they care that also can be addressed.

I don't know what to do about someone who appears to neither think about the problem, nor care about it.

Nice. How to do "it"?

See Mandela, Gandhi, MLK for details.

And wait until the Empire suffers a defeat
to implement.

And expect to get shot for your efforts.

It's no accident that MLK was shot in Memphis
organizing the garbage workers.

http://flag.blackened.net/daver/anarchism/iron_fist.html

It is beyond my ability or purpose here to describe a world where a true market system could have developed without such state intervention. A world in which peasants had held onto their land and property was widely distributed, capital was freely available to laborers through mutual banks, productive technology was freely available in every country without patents, and every people was free to develop locally without colonial robbery, is beyond our imagination. But it would have been a world of decentralized, small-scale production for local use, owned and controlled by those who did the work--as different from our world as day from night, or freedom from slavery.

THE SUBSIDY OF HISTORY

Accordingly, the single biggest subsidy to modern corporate capitalism is the subsidy of history, by which capital was originally accumulated in a few hands, and labor was deprived of access to the means of production and forced to sell itself on the buyer's terms. The current system of concentrated capital ownership and large-scale corporate organization is the direct beneficiary of that original structure of power and property ownership, which has perpetuated itself over the centuries.

Arkansaw of Samuel L Clemens