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132 comments on Transitioning to A Society of Sloth?
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132 comments on Transitioning to A Society of Sloth?
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GAIA Host Collective
No - he's over-estimating by a factor of 2 :-)
Is it really going to be that easy to grow, transport, process and cook food for 7+ billion people in the post petroleum world? To supply fertilizer? Or to educate and train doctors, nurses, technologists and other medical professions? Or to supply the plastics and other materials for modern medical care, shelter and clothing?
I think Jay thought that the inhabitants (if any) of the post-petroleum world will be producing the bulk of their own food, shelter, and clothing within family units, without recourse to markets.
I don't think (from his web site's title, Dieoff.org) that Jay assumed we would have 7+ billion people in a post-petroleum world.
Actually, toilet paper is not that essential. I am in the process of weaning myself off it. It is just a heavily indoctrinated habit. With water on tap in our houses (I presume for all TOD readers, except maybe Airdale?), we really have no excuse not to simply use small cloths to wipe our butts. Wipe, immediately rinse in small bucket, put that water in the toilet, rinse again, with a little disinfectant in the water if you want, and wash hands. Using water recycled from the bath or shower of course.
Same for menstrual pads, and babies' nappies (diapers!). I have only last month broken the habit of buying disposable women's stuff, daring to question the system. But once you do it, and form your new habit, it's not that hard.
Krokodilla,
Ur right. Last time I ran out ,,,during the big ice storm, I quit buying it.
Right now I use paper towels. These are far more sturdy and,,well if one goes alternate routes then no need to digress. You learn and adapt.
There are lengths to which I have yet to go in some areas. Before long perhaps I will go back to the outside outhouse, after putting something up.
Then of course one lets the hair grow. I had to pay my own girl cousin $14 for my last haircut and that was last year and that is when I stopped going to somewhere. I just cut it myself and the beard takes care of itself after a while. Trim with scissors is all thats needed. Once you grow a beard you notice that suddenly people treat you a little different. Not good or not bad,,but just differently.
Airdale
Actually Airdale, I thought you may be one of the few of us TOD readers who is living without mains water on tap.
In Australia it is not that uncommon, people on rural "lifestyle" blocks and some of those out in the country are not on mains water, they depend on rainwater harvesting off their own roof, with several 20KL rainwater tanks, and/or water storage in dams on the property that capture the run off from their own land. But I don't know how common this is in Western countries outside of Australia, nor how many of our Australian TOD readers are off the grid in terms of water.
Living like this makes you REALLY appreciate the value of water. It also teaches you not to flush unless you have to. I have taken the next logical step, and only flush when I have to, using water caught from the bathtub, a 12L bucket poured in fast and high does the job nicely (it helps having the toilet and bucket right next the the bath!)
Anyway, I presume you are composting your used paper towels!
cheers, Soph
Yes composting everything that will compost.
I am on a very deep well. Setting in an aquifer that if went dry then the rest of the USA would long ago have ran out everywhere.
At the junctions of 4 big rivers we settle a lot of water into the aquifer. Its sand and gravel most of the way. They hit mine at 200 feet. With 50 extra to spare.
I don't worry about water too much for I would pull the pump and let a old fashioned sleeve down the hole. Get about 1 or 2 gallons that way. Enough easily for one days use. Some springs not too far off.
For all else catch water off this metal roof.
Airdale
I figured!
:-)
We're in Tasmania and off the grid for water which is true for most people around here who don't live right in a town. Even with the recent drought we've managed to avoid buying in water though it got very close as we have a veggie plot out the back. We have 60KL of main water storage and another 23KL in a fire tank. We conserve and reuse water whenever possible in the summer, catching shower water to use in the children's bath, then taking that water out to the garden, etc...Plus our house was plumbed with a separate greywater system so the rest of it goes to the natives out the front.
There's some extra work but it is a nice feeling that the water falling on your roof is not being carried away in a storm drain. That your shower water is not being piped in from a treatment plant and then carried back in a sewer pipe. Plus it makes you think a lot more about what you use to clean with, cause it's staying right there on your property! And finally, you get a whole new appreciation for the rain. Not a nuisance anymore but something to be celebrated.
I think Tassie would be one of the best places to be in the future. I am working on it... I am in Adelaide, and it's only got to get more water stressed, especially with these bloody stupid population growth policies in place!
One of my younger relatives just moved onto a rural lifestyle block, off the water grid, 2x20KL tanks... and she ran out! Had to buy 5KL, a couple of days before that big lot of rain last month. She's learnt by experience, the most effective way... Although there are some scenarios coming up in the future that I don't want to learn to manage via experience, which is why I value the OilDrum Campfire so much!
Actually the bucket and disinfectant are not required. This issue was discussed on TOD a month or so ago. All you need is a jug of water. Poor with one hand and wipe with the finger of the other hand. You only need the towel to pat yourself dry. Naturally you need to wash your toilet hand well afterwards.
I find the bucket convenient because; a) I put my used bath water in it as required; b) 12L is a good amount to flush away a poo. So the bucket doubles for damping the cloth and rinsing it.
I missed the discussion from a month ago, can you help me locate it?
Cheers, Soph
The discussion can be found here
Thanks!