DrumBeat: October 26, 2007


Oil bigger threat than climate change in 10 years

Rising oil prices are a bigger threat to the world economy than climate change in the next 10 years - that was the surprising verdict of company executives from carbon trading, fuel cell, oil exploration and solar power firms who attended the Reuters Smaller Companies Forum.

But climate change is likely to have a greater effect on the global economy over a 50-year timespan, according to those executives from old and new energy companies.

How secure are Middle East oil supplies?

High oil prices, threats of terrorist attacks, instability in many oil-exporting countries and the rise in so-called ‘oil nationalism’ have raised serious concerns about the security of oil supplies.


Peak Oil Passnotes: Fractured Markets

Another week, another record. As you will no doubt have seen, the Nymex crude oil price for delivery to Cushing jumped to more than $92 per barrel this week. We are now being told that this figure is near the “inflation-adjusted” price for an all-time high. Yet we are also told there is little worry for the economy. We are told that modern economies do not react in the same way as before; we are told to rest easy.

This is not the case - it is not accurate. As readers of this column note, there is little love lost here for the current economic system and its charlatanesque moniker of “free markets.” The markets are most certainly not free and quite often they are hardly markets. Especially in the United States and Europe.


GM tests fuel cell cars in real world

Beginning early next year, General Motors will be lending 100 Chevrolet Equinox Fuel Cell Vehicles to "everyday" American families as well as to a few celebrities and politicians.

Besides the public relations value - hence the celebrities and politicians - GM will also be gathering feedback on how people use the vehicles, how easy they find fueling them, and how they like driving them day-to-day.


Boone ‘Peak Oil’ Call Supported, But Asset Class Leery

Boone may be right.

The point of maximum oil production known as “Peak Oil” is upon us, said Energy Watch Group, a think tank based in Germany.

According to the Peak Oil hypothesis, oil production worldwide will plummet in the wake of Peak Oil.

...Don Paul, chief technology officer of massive energy conglomerate Chevron Corp., called the Peak Oil hypothesis “probably real” and admitted the oil supply will in all likelihood continue to dwindle—though he shrugged off the potential for catastrophe, noting the ascent of alternative energy.

But it was hedge-fund magnate T. Boone Pickens who brought the Peak Oil issue into focus last week with his prediction that oil would hit $100 a barrel.


Here comes $100 oil, and $3 gas

With oil prices setting records over $90 a barrel and $100 looking ever more likely, experts say there's a good chance drivers will see $3 gasoline before the end of the year.

"Three dollar gasoline in this market is unavoidable," said Stephen Schork, publisher of the industry newsletter the Schork Report. "At this rate, we're going to see $4 a gallon."


U.S. Strategy With Iran and OPEC to Push Oil Above $100

In the coming months, crude oil prices will be heading above $100 per barrel if all speculations are coming true about increased global demand, lower stocks worldwide and a Middle East conflict with Iran. If OPEC next month at its Saudi Arabia summit will not present a 1.5 million to 2 million bpd production increase, the market should be expecting record price levels without any doubt. Al Badri’s comments have come after the U.S. Secretary of Energy Samuel Bodman urged the oil cartel to increase its production volumes to counter a too-tight global supply and demand market. Even though OPEC has repeatedly claimed not to have set its own target price for crude oil, analysts are increasingly indicating that the oil cartel has set a minimum price level of $60 per barrel, while the upper range is totally in the open. Some hardliners in OPEC, including Iran and Venezuela, are not at all unhappy with the current price developments.


Oil CEO Calls for Energy Security Plan

The U.S. risks losing its competitive edge in a global economy if it does not soon address the country's energy needs, climate change and foreign policy in a comprehensive way, the chief executive of Marathon Oil said Friday.


Research on a dire problem - carbon capture - gets going

"Without carbon capture and sequestration, we are all toast."

Jiang Lin, a scientist with the China Sustainable Energy Program with Lawrence Berkeley Lab, issued that gloomy proclamation earlier this week and it's a fitting description of the current world situation when it comes to global warming. To make it worse, I asked Lin about how the world is responding to the challenge. Not well.


Trolley, jitney system MCRS meeting topic

Richard Jergensen adds, "but once in place the trolley and jitney system would allow them to park their cars after they come down the hill and then run errands around town without increasing street traffic or pollution in the valley. "Residents in town could literally garage their cars except for trips out of the area by using the Little Lake Trolley and jitneys."

"For three years Willits Economic LocaLization (WELL) has been informing the community about peak oil concerns and the need for local sustainability," Smith notes. "MCRS is now spearheading an effort to get sustainable transportation in town.


Alberta royalty grab stuns oil industry

Alberta Premier Ed Stelmach infuriated the province's oil industry Thursday with surprisingly aggressive plans to take more money from the energy business, but the increases are less than a government-commissioned panel recommended last month.

The government said that under the new regime, money collected from the energy business could be 20 per cent higher in 2010 than forecast, potentially bringing an additional $1.4-billion to the treasury. That figure is nearly half a billion dollars less than the expert review panel wanted.


Is Alberta out of step with the world?

OTTAWA — You would think from the anguished cries of the oil companies that the Alberta government's decision to increase royalties was a bolt from the blue.

Far from it.


How California reaped its firestorm

Cities such as Tucson, Arizona, are built in a desert, where golf courses, lawns and swimming pools guzzle up precious water supplies, fed largely from the Colorado River. Unfortunately that river also supplies 30 million people across seven states and Mexico, including cities such as Los Angeles and Phoenix, and it is fast running low on water. The Colorado has been in drought for more than a decade and is flowing less than during the Dust Bowl years in the 1930s. The river’s water management now relies mostly on prayer. “Nature never intended to support this many people here,” said David Nahai, president of the Los Angeles water and power commissioners.


Different natural disaster, same risky human habits

But one thing that the wildfires share with Katrina is that both natural disasters were made worse by the propensity of people to build homes in high-risk areas. Katrina's economic impact was magnified by development along the vulnerable Gulf Coast. Similarly, the wildfires have been particularly brutal in newly developed communities in fire-prone scrublands and dry pine forests.


Diesel shortage hits Victorian ambulances

Rural Ambulance Victoria says a shortage of diesel caused two of its ambulances to almost ran out of fuel this week.

Low supplies forced ambulance crews to abandon some vehicles in Swan Hill and Morwell this week, and replace them with others.


Crude Realities: Oil Production and Politics

You probably use oil in one way or another every day of your life: powering your car, heating your house and even manufacturing all the plastic around you. It has also been a source of war, made millions for some and ruined the lives of others. Here is a look at some major oil infrastructure and the conflicts surrounding the black gold.


'This is like a highway with no cops and no speed limit'

But something funny is going on now. It appears increasingly obvious that oil prices are being pushed into the stratosphere by speculators in a lightly regulated global trading market that has grown by leaps and bounds.

Traditional supply-and-demand factors can't explain the price jump. There's no shortage of oil or gasoline, nor major supply disruptions. World oil demand has stabilized at about 85 million barrels a day.


Mexico probes fatal oil rig crash

Mexican President Felipe Calderon has ordered an inquiry after an accident on an offshore oil platform in the Gulf of Mexico left at least 19 people dead.

Huge waves knocked the platform onto its side and into a drilling rig, setting off gas and oil leaks.

Desperate workers scrambled into life rafts to escape.


Pemex says two U.S. deepwater fields may leech Mexican oil

Two deepwater oil fields under development in U.S. Gulf waters may cause Mexican oil to leak into wells on the other side of the maritime border, said the head of Mexican state oil firm Petroleos Mexicanos on Thursday.

While the U.S. is busy developing deepwater oil reservoirs in up to 10,000 feet of water, Mexico is watching from the bleachers. Pemex, as the state firm is known, currently lacks the technology to drill deeper than 3,000 feet and is constitutionally prohibited from teaming up with outside firms who can.


Nuclear power isn't the answer

There's again a move to "revive" nuclear power. Every decade or so those with a vested interest in this deadly dangerous technology have sought to get the public to swallow the nuclear pill — and it's happening again.


India: The Myth Of Free Nuclear Energy

THE Congress and its spokespersons have been on overdrive selling a number of myths about the benefits of the India-US Nuclear Deal. Foremost in that has been that of a mythical nuclear bus, which if we do not hop on right now, will leave us in permanent electricity deficit. The bus apparently carries free nuclear energy; all we need to do to tap into this free source of energy is hop on to the bus. In this spin, it is this intransigent Left, stuck in a time warp, which is causing India to miss the bus. The media has been lapping up this vision of free nuclear energy, without any application of either mind or checking up on the facts of nuclear energy. Given the wide-spread credence that the myths about nuclear energy are being given, we are now forced to spend some of our energy on de-constructing these myths.


Arguments on Sustainable Oil Supply Gone Haywire

In the meantime, Matthew Simmons, having made a name for him in projecting the imminent end of oil era, is back in trade suggesting Saudi Aramco may not hit its oil production goals.

...The current Simmons' diatribe is despite the fact that Aramco is boosting spending on projects to raise its capacity from 11.3 million barrels to 12.5 million bpd by 2009. Riyadh will raise output to 9 million bpd from around 8.7 million now, under OPEC's new ceiling effective Nov. 1. Other Gulf oil producers have ambitious programs too. Oil and natural gas producers elsewhere are also pouring money into oilfield services to jack up production declines from fields in the North Sea and Mexico.


Oil Price To Hit US$100; One Thing That Could Cause a Correction

“It’s not a question of when we’ll hit US$100 but how quickly,” Nauman Barakat tells Bloomberg. Barakat, the senior vice president of global energy futures at Macquarie Futures USA Inc. was not talking about Macquarie Bank’s share price. He was talking about oil. “There are no bearish factors in the market right now.”

None?


BP axes jobs as BNP proved right on Peak Oil

Further evidence that peak oil is a reality comes today from one of the world’s energy giants as falling production and refinery shutdowns are blamed for a 45% plunge in quarterly profits at BP.


John Michael Greer: The age of salvage societies

We may attempt to build any future we happen to like, but unless the earth’s remaining stock of natural resources provides the raw material that the future in question requires, we’ll find sooner or later that we’re out of luck. Furthermore, even if the future we have in mind can be made to work within the hard limits of ecological reality, the future we want will once again turn out to be a pipe dream if another form of society or economy does the same thing more effectively.


Should Scientists Embrace Economic Growth?

The assumption of continuous economic growth lurks behind most scientific endeavors. Should scientists embrace this growth which is often presented as a panacea for the relief of poverty, the stability of society and even the improvement of the environment? Or is unbridled growth increasingly undermining these important aims?


Saudi King Tries to Grow Modern Ideas in Desert

On a marshy peninsula 50 miles from this Red Sea port, King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia is staking $12.5 billion on a gargantuan bid to catch up with the West in science and technology.


GE hopes to cut mercury in "green" light bulbs

General Electric Co is working to cut the amount of mercury in energy-saving fluorescent lightbulbs which have soared in popularity.


Beck falsely claimed "the globe was the hottest" in 1934 -- it was actually 2005

Glenn Beck declared that "the globe was the hottest" in 1934; in fact, according to NASA's Goddard Institute for Space Studies, the hottest year on Earth was actually 2005, and 1934 -- now designated the hottest year on record in the U.S. after a revision in climate data -- does not even rank among the globe's five warmest years. Beck also suggested that the statistic "was, I believe, intentionally distorted by the guy the left holds up as the scientist on global warming," an apparent reference to GISS director James Hansen. In August, the GISS revised historical climate data because "the monthly more-or-less-automatic updates of our global temperature analysis had a flaw in the U.S. data."


No to coal

Before approving a costly and irreversible program to build a new generation of coal-fired power plants, Texas officials should carefully study the statements of James Hansen. He's the director of the New York City-based NASA Institute for Space Studies and one of the first scientists to speak out on the threat of global warming caused by man-made greenhouse gases.


Oil price hits record-high 92 dollars in New York

World oil prices surged to historic highs Friday, breaching 92 dollars for the first time in New York on rising tension in crude-rich Iran and tight US energy supplies, analysts said.

"Now that oil is in the 90s, it is much easier to reach 100 dollars. Anything can happen in this market," Astmax fund manager Tetsu Emori said.

New York's main futures contract, light sweet crude for delivery in December, soared to a record-high 92.22 dollars per barrel.


A slap in the face for Big Oil

Premier Ed Stelmach rolled out a new deal yesterday on oil and gas development, the mainstay of his economy and Canada's biggest spender, that is sure to deflate a phenomenal boom and redefine the province's image.

In Calgary, the mood was somber among big players and small. The new terms reinforce the message that even in the country's top oil-producing province, this is a new anti-oil industry era.


What now for the oil industry?

Some 350 BP staff are now facing the axe, the majority in Aberdeen.

At a time when oil prices are soaring, we might wonder why a cull should be needed.

BP's argument is simple - to restore profit and viability.


6 oil workers kidnapped in Nigeria

Gunmen in speedboats attacked an oil vessel off the coast of Nigeria at dawn Friday and kidnapped six workers, Italian energy giant Eni SpA said.


'Food miles' soared by 31% in a year, study reveals

Almost a third more food was flown into Britain last year than in 2005, embarrassing the Government which has promised to slash the pollution and congestion from "food miles".


Not an environment scare story

A landmark assessment by the UN of the state of the world's environment paints the bleakest picture yet of our planet's well-being. The warning is stark: humanity's future is at risk unless urgent action is taken. Over the past 20 years, almost every index of the planet's health has worsened. At the same time, personal wealth in the richest countries has grown by a third.


White House defends 'health benefits' of climate change

The White House on Thursday defended its prediction that climate change would bring some "health benefits" to humans, a forecast unlikely to endear it to critics of the US environmental record.


Climate change seen hurting poor regions

Latin America and other poor regions of the world will bear the brunt of climate change, a top official from the organization that shared this year's Nobel Peace Prize said Thursday.

Reading the previous thread, "You might have heard that CLZ07 went through $90 today..." makes me wonder.

What if KSA has decided that Gee Dubyah and associates aren't their friends anymore? Given their culture, I've always thought that Condi isn't someone they would pay much attention to. While they were clearly happy to see Saddam neutralized and they are worried that Iran might win in Iraq, I doubt that they would be interested in a U.S. war with Iran. Maybe they've decided to pull the plug on the neocons. If the price of oil stays high thru the election, Joe Sixpack and Billy FourWheeler (I like that one) will be in a hanging mood and the Repuglicans will find themselves buried in a landslide. I'm afraid that we are in for an interesting year until next November. Just a thought....

E. Swanson

As long as gasoline stays stable they'll get a free ride on the dollar having tanked because the electorate isn't paying attention to the exchange rates - yet. Put the dollar back where it was a year ago and recalculate. Maybe it's time to present the oil price in a basket of currencies to give a more accurate picture of what's really happening. As I see it, oil is really about $65 and the dollar tanked, but that's never on the news.

Petrosaurus- whereas you may have a valid point in your reflections –

(full sarcanol-alert issued, with a tad of moral-lesson)
- I from my neck of the woods believe there is “a divine finger” pointing at the the most thoughtless crowd among us earthlings – namely the American-earthlings and in particular their leaders and voters - and non-voters.. hey that actually make up all Americans..

“The divine finger” simply zooms and beams the main-cost-change at the $-users who are the very worst among them energy_may_run_out- AND climate_may_cause_damage -Deniers .. their way of understanding natural recourses and their limitations is simply not permitted by “the finger”, or should I say lack of understanding .. as in NONE at all -
:-)

The Republicans are already giving up the White House and they may have to hand over a supermajority in both the House and Senate. This is the national mood before the ARM scam unwinds next spring.

Its like a domestic dispute where both parties are bloodied when the police cars arrive. Someone is going to have some consequences and its just a question of whether the neocon/disloyal Christian Right shadow coup moves forward or the 75%+ of the population who don't agree have a nice, juicy housecleaning.

I'm personally in favor of ejecting a whole bunch of Republicans, investigating, prosecuting, and incarcerating some more, and shipping those who've earned it off to the Hague for a war crimes tribunal. This attitude of desiring the rule of the law to take its course makes me into things like a phony American and a terrorist sympathizer, one who hates our freedoms.

Oh, and along with the executive and legislative branch problems I really want someone to pull the plug on the right wing noise machine, starting with Bill O'Reilly, who should be sentenced to 84 days of scrubbing toilets at Fort Bragg as an apology for slandering those Rangers who were executed by the SS on December 17th, 1944.

http://mediamatters.org/items/200606030002

this assumes Democrats actually get their act together and take advantage of this - i am not convinced they won't snatch defeat from the jaws of victory
--
All these memories will be lost in time
like tears in rain

Someone called 'em DemocRats and I think I'm gonna start using that myself.

I am personally more interested in portions of the Progressive agenda, but there is much not to love there. There is simply no use for this radical feminist nonsense - they are the DemocRats' moral equivalent of the disloyal Christian Right and we'll have to watch them almost as closely. I could not care less what two adult men want to do in their own home but the gay rights focus concerns me - if that carries through I'd like to see it come through as the right to life, liberty, and property for all, with their concerns being addressed as a byproduct rather than a focus.

What is good about the DemocRats is the strong probability that single payer health care will come to pass and the foolish bankruptcy bill will be rolled back. These two things greatly constrain the creativity of the American people at a time when we need to take risks and try new things as we adapt to peak oil. They are also far more likely to make the correct moves for the environment and I look forward to again having a reality based foreign policy for our country.

The Republicans are just laughable. I'd much rather stick around and correct the DemocRats' confusion regarding the second amendment than have to stand over the Republicans watching each and every thing they do with my fingers crossed they'll listen to the 3/4ths of us who aren't religious fanatics. Bush has totally and completely ruined the Republican franchise and I really expect the party to splinter and die, leaving a radical Christian bit and the remainder will cleave to the center, perhaps later causing a split in the DemocRatic party with their radicals going their own way.

The part people don't realize is that the DemocRats are owned by the same interests as the NeoCons and there would be no change whatsoever in foreign policy.

The only change would be a ruinous wealth transfer to illegals, a sure one way ticket to Zimbabwe.

People didn't vote for Perot then and will not vote for Ron Paul in enough numbers now.

But he is the only hope for us.

You should spend a little less time listening to Rush Limbaugh and a little more time talking with your neighbors. The only ruinous wealth transfer we've seen in this country is the Bush war funded by tax cuts(!) and the privatize and loot dance they do so well.

And if you think foreign policy wouldn't be different you're really not paying attention.

There's plenty of room for debate about illegals, ruinous wealth transfer, etc. But one thing I feel pretty confident in saying is that Rush Limbaugh - a big cheerleader for the Iraq war - isn't supporting Ron Paul for president.

I have a quite wide range of friends, associates and hang arounds and none of them is really wealthy. Anything from small business owners to professionals and blue collar craftsmen.

Out of several hundred people only two are left wing, and they both are in CA. They are entertaining up to a point.

Many would like to see different conservative leadership though, so to that extent we agree.

Hang around long enough and you might just see the Hillabeast bomb Iran while we are laying on a South American beach with an umbrella drink watching the girls.

See, I actually hope you can convince a bunch of people to try it your way, we don't want the beach to be crowded.

The South Americans will be shooting at you because of how they suffered under our attempts to impose "free enterprise" on them the last 20 years. That's what you get for thinking that your right-wing friends aren't wealthy when they make 20 times what folks down there do.

And Musashi, where do you get off damning "inferior", "criminal", "lazy" Latin immigrants at every opportunity, and thinking you can just move to their lands whenever you need someone new to exploit?

There are all sorts of Latin Americans as there are all sorts of people here.
I lived in several Latin American countries long enough to understand them quite well.
There is no doubt in my mind that the upper class in countries like Mexico actively encourages their unemployable social loads to move north. In that sense they are a political football or victims if you wish, but they are the financial responsibility of their own government and not of the American taxpayer.

The same Mexican officials that whine at us actively discourage immigration into their own country by force at their southern border. Like everyone else around here, they want it both ways.

From reading some of your other posts it is clear that you should be able to understand what is going on easily, even if it doesn't fit your views. It is what it is.

That is an unsupportable pile of monkey poo that you've just dumped in this thread, sir.

The United States did receive a good lot of undesirables ... from Cuba ... once ... a long time ago. The Cuban government simply drained about 2,500 behavior problems from the prison system and stirred them in with the 125,000 who came here during the Marielito boat lift.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marielito

Other than this one event a generation ago the people we see coming from Central and South America are generally industrious, law abiding, and very much following in the footsteps of every ethnic group who ever migrated to this country. Most articles I see on the matter indicate concern over the brain drain happening in Mexico as their best and brightest come north, but I do tend to read liberal crap like The Economist and Foreign Affairs. I suppose you've got some peer reviewed wingnuttery that counters this assessment?

You read too much BS.
The truth is that most Mexican professionals don't even want to live here. I have a number of friends down there, they may have studied here, they may come to shop here from time to time but they don't want to live here. Some that came here legally moved back.

IMO there also is no comparison to the Cuban people, I don't know that situation first hand but my impression is that it was a purely political situation.
The situation with the Mexican indians, for lack of a better term, is purely driven by economics on all sides. Their real enemy is their own government. Guess what? They don't want to be here either.

This is a very different situation from a generation or two ago, when people that came here even for economic reasons actually wanted to be integrated into our culture.

You guys can say whatever you want, I spent better then half my 20+ years all over Latin America and know along which lines the various people generally think.
I still ride my bike down there when I feel like it. Nothing happens. The only country down there I wouldn't go alone is Colombia, other then that, no big deal.

musashi--
I agree with your comments about Columbia---
Totally off the charts, if you are looking for edge (interrogation by the Columbian Secret Police, DAS, was one of my most unpleasant memories).
Your economic analysis is totally wrong from my experience, having driven the length of Mexico and Central America several times.
You really should educate yourself and visit Argentina, the best model for economic new ideas so far. Latin America is the one bright spot on the planet.
Anyway, with the collapse of the Mexican oil situation, things are going to get interesting fast. I spent last February down in Guerrero, and outright rebellion and supervision is happening now in society.
I have rich friends in Mexico City, and even they see the end.
You need a more developed analysis.
(Not your fault, probably clueless gringo drifting through life)

Drums of war on Iran louder and louder

"Republican candidate Mitt Romney said he would consider a military blockade or "bombardment of some kind" to prevent Iran from gaining a nuclear weapon"

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071025/ap_po/candidates_iran

"The Quds Force is the "Iranian regime's primary instrument for providing lethal support to the Taliban," and it "provides weapons and financial support to the Taliban to support anti-U.S. and anti-coalition activity in Afghanistan," the Treasury Department alleged Thursday in announcing economic sanctions against the Quds Force and other Iranian military and financial entities."

http://edition.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/10/25/quds.force/index.html

Uh oh. Updated 12 minutes ago

""Iran also funnels hundreds of millions of dollars each year through the international financial system to terrorists," said Paulson."

And ""We will be open to the discussion of any issue," said Rice. "But if Iran's rulers choose to continue down a path of confrontation, the United States will act with the international community to resist these threats of the Iranian regime."

Despite "Mohamed ElBaradei, director-general of the United Nations' International Atomic Energy Agency, has criticized U.S. rhetoric on Iran and said last month that Iran's declared nuclear material has not been diverted from peaceful use"

http://edition.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/10/26/iran.sanctions/index.html

Who is forcing the confrontation here? Who is trying to force the path of escalation? How can Americans not see the same rhetoric going on here as we heard for Iraq? Do we secretly want this adminstration to go forward with its plans so that we have "energy security"? This must be true because no one is protesting all this "inevitability". Or are we just too frightened these days?

"Who is forcing the confrontation here? Who is trying to force the path of escalation?"

Exactly.

What is interesting this time is that Putin has basically drawn a line and maybe BushCo will step over it. China is silent, but you know that if Iran gets hit the dollar is going to get smacked hard. It also looks like Turkey favors Iran over the USA. BushCo (and the Rethugs like Paulson and Romney) are certainly unifying the various regions of East and Northeast Asia.

Yep...I think Iran and Russia have a tight relationship that is mostly not advertised...especially after the deals they have made over pipelines in the Caspian. I would not be surprised if KSA and Russia have some under the table dealings in case of the inevitable. Turkey is growing more and more anti-USA and pro-Iran for now, although they can be wishy-washy about their alliances. China thinks they can call their own shots, but when push comes to shove, I think they will side with Russia due to proximity and other factors.

And China will play their currency card. They have a lot to lose, but it still is a communist country, and it may be one way to curb runaway economic growth.

China and Russia already have very string ties with Russia. Off course they'll side with Russia. If Iran is attacked, WWIII breaks loose.

Bush talking up WWIII as well.

For a world war to take place, there must be parties on both sides. Who would be on our side in any substantial way?

Europe. The Western Industrial Empire will stick (and fail) together, because we serve the same masters.

In the past, you would think most of South America would be on our side, not any more.

Good thing Europe isn't dependent upon Russia in any way.

Europe is dependent upon Russia !!!!!
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/fn/5245537.html
www.oxfordprospect.co.uk/Nabucco.htm - 14k

and
http://www.depletion-scotland.org.uk/gas_deptn.htm

EU imports mor then 40% of natural gas and around 20% oil from russia some countries are almost 100% dependant up on it

Brian was being sarcastic, essentially pointing out that Europe cannot be aligned with the US because it is dependant on Russian fuel (I think). They are of course, but what if Europeans do not believe that Russia will be able or willing to continue to do that (likely)?

The big question is, what governments other then the US and UK are so penetrated that they will sacrifice the welfare of their own people for a third party?

It seems the third party is way out of luck once PO and fiscal bankruptcy in the US hit, that's why this faction is so eager to have the fur fly.

Who would be on our side in any substantial way?

Should be "Bush's side". He will not be able to con us again. He will not have much support in the US either even if he does drag us into a war with much of the rest of the world.

That depends.

If he uses nukes on Iran, there is a chance, a small chance, that the American people will become so terrified of the punishment we will receive for Bush's crimes that we will rally behind him and escalate into WW3. It happened in Nazi Germany once people realized that the Red Army was coming for them.

I mean, it's not like anyone here has managed to stop the bastard so far.

Talking of Nazi bastards:

''Do not rejoice in his defeat, you men. For though the world has stood up and stopped the bastard, the bitch that bore him is in heat again''.

- Bertold Brecht.

Will Shrub and the angry hog do it?

They believe in God, end times and possibly rapture.(the ultimate get out)
One believes that God talks to him (time for straight jacket)
They believe a world without a supreme America is not one worth living in. ( See 'The Downfall' - German film on DVD)
They are surrounded by toadies and sycophants who tell them what they want to hear. (Again, see Downfall)
The next election will topple them.
After the next election, they may become pariah, hunted men who cannot travel for fear of indictment or worse.(Again, get Downfall out. A truly brilliant film)
After the next election, there is risk. Risk of Indictment in the US.

Answer?

Remove the risk. Go to war. Suspend the Democratic process. Get the enemy without set up and the enemy within coralled. Create fear and hysteria.

''Better an end in hell than a hell without end'' - Chalked on walls in Berlin 1945.

Above all, retain power.

Its the Furherprinzip.

The last thing between you and this fate is whatever sane and honourable parts of the US Officer Corps are still left.

You need a Count Claus Von Stauffenburg.

The parallels are striking.

Anyway, Good luck.

All too true - America for them is defined as a country dominating the North American continent with them in charge. The end of them would be the end of the country, and thusly the logic of destroying the village to save the village gets applied at a national level.

What a bunch of clowns - Bush & Co. for who they are, the legislature for not taking a belt to their backsides the day after they were sworn in, the compromised Supreme Court which I fear will never be cleansed, and the complicit war whore mainstream media.

Too true, the world owes much to the members of the US military who remember that their oath is to the constitution not the President, and are prepared to risk their lives (there are alot of 'accidents' happening to military personel) to do what is best for their nation.

Without these people I suspect the US would already be at war with Iran.