DrumBeat: October 13, 2006

[Update by Leanan on 10/13/06 at 9:19 AM EDT]

Oil platform off Angolan waters testifies to Africa's growing importance

"Within a few years, analysts reckon Nigeria (Africa's biggest oil producer) will be playing catch-up with Angola" in deep-water production, Petroleum Economist magazine says in its latest edition.

Angola's oil output is projected to surpass 2 million barrels a day next year and increase by 90 percent from 2005 levels by 2010, according to conservative estimates of the International Monetary Fund. It says that would double Angolan government revenues, even allowing for a price drop. Chevron produces just over 500,000 barrels a day and plans to double production in the next five years.

Statoil, Shell shut in 13% of Norway output for 1-2 weeks

OSLO, Oct 13 (Reuters) - The operators of Norway's Snorre A and Draugen oilfields said on Friday they will halt 280,000 barrels of oil equivalent per day output for a week or two to make safety improvements to lifeboats.

...The shutdowns, ordered by Norway's Petroleum Safety Authority, will equal almost 13 percent of the country's oil production, which amounted to 2.25 million barrels per day in September according to figures released last week.


China's Tarim oil fields may see 50% output increase in 2006

PetroChina Co said gas and oil output from the Tarim Basin fields in northwest China's Xinjiang Uygur Autonomous Region may jump 50 pct this year as the company intensifies its search for new supplies, state media reported.


Oil prices curtail demand in developed countries

High prices are for the first time in two decades prompting oil demand in developed countries to decrease, the International Energy Agency says.


Attacks on energy rising

Attacks on energy facilities worldwide to hinder the delivery of gas and oil have been rising sharply, the head of Germany's foreign intelligence agency said on Thursday.

"In the past few years we have registered a significant increase in terrorist attacks on energy infrastructure and we must state that there have been qualitative changes," the head of Germany's Bundesnachrichtendienst (BND), Ernst Uhrlau, told a conference on energy security organised by the BND.


Costly oil makes Nova Scotia ports more attractive

MATTHEW SIMMONS is friendly enough but his message isn’t always welcomed, especially by the energy sector.

But from a Nova Scotia point of view, Simmons’s message is a positive because it has the potential of drawing more attention to Nova Scotia as a gateway for goods from Asia to reach North America.


Colombian Indians protest oil drilling

Hundreds of Bari Indians, most clad in loincloths and carrying bows and arrows, came down from the hills in their first march ever Thursday to demand that the state-owned oil company stop drilling on sacred land abutting their reservation.


US motorists gear up to use greener diesel fuel

The drive to convert American motorists to diesel will take a big step forward during the next few days as a more environmentally friendly version of the fuel goes on sale.

The clean-burning ultra-low sulphur diesel emits only 15 parts per million of sulphur, compared with 500 parts for existing diesel.


Study: Climate change inaction will cost trillions

Failing to fight global warming now will cost trillions of dollars by the end of the century even without counting biodiversity loss or unpredictable events like the Gulf Stream shutting down, a study said on Friday.

But acting now will avoid some of the massive damage and cost relatively little, said the study commissioned by Friends of the Earth from the Global Development and Environment Institute of Tufts University in the United States.


Megan Quinn: Proposing Plan C


Downloadable audio: Dick Lawrence and Steve Andrews on ASPO USA Boston Conference


Israel: Desert oil find fuels dream but could prove mirage


Germany, France Urge Russia to Ratify Energy Charter

France and Germany urged Russia to ratify an international energy charter that would provide the European Union with greater security for its energy supplies.


Home wind turbines turn fashionable in Britain


Economic Growth Will Drive Biofuel Industry

“Economic growth is driving these developments,” notes Patricia Woertz, CEO of Archer Daniels Midland, a leading supplier of ethanol. “Global real GDP growth is expected to average 3.8% annually through 2030. But it is economic growth in Asia projected to average 5.5% per year that is shaping world scenarios - in particular China, with a 6% GDP followed by India at 5.4%.”


Grain stockpiles at lowest for 25 years

The world’s stockpiles of wheat are at their lowest level in more than a quarter century, according to the US Department of Agriculture, which on Thursday slashed its forecasts for global wheat and corn production.


Byron W. King: Hubbert's Defense Department

WHAT WILL THE WORLD LOOK LIKE on the backside of Hubbert's Peak? What you see depends upon where you stand. If you happen to stand in the Pentagon, the headquarters of the U.S. Department of Defense, the view is rather sobering. Well, what I mean to say is that if the view is not rather sobering, then whoever is doing the looking had better get their eyes checked.
Here's an interesting and well-written article, "Beyond corn: Ethanol's next generation", in today's Chicago Tribune that delves into current cellulosic ethanol research.
Afgans have a good cellulose source and the Cunucks try to destroy it... go figure.

--------------

Canada Troops Battle 10-ft Afghan Marijuana Plants

..."We tried burning them with white phosphorous -- it didn't work. We tried burning them with diesel -- it didn't work. The plants are so full of water right now ... that we simply couldn't burn them," he said.

Even successful incineration had its drawbacks.

"A couple of brown plants on the edges of some of those (forests) did catch on fire. But a section of soldiers that was downwind from that had some ill effects and decided that was probably not the right course of action," Hillier said dryly.

One soldier told him later: "Sir, three years ago before I joined the army, I never thought I'd say 'That damn marijuana'."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20061012/wl_canada_nm/canada_canada_marijuana_col;_ylt=Ajq8M_5I7cingqJnjg tuceJvaA8F;_ylu=X3oDMTA0cDJlYmhvBHNlYwM-

Misplaced ignorance in the USA.
Note they are burning the crops due to militant's ability to use it for cover and camouflage, rather than any ideological reason.
True.  It is also interesting to note that they hide in the forest of pot b/c of the heat signature of a pot field is high and they blend in.  Nature is awesome!
NOT cover and concealment, just cover. Concealment is protection against bullets. Like hiding behind some rocks, a good earth berm, etc. Concealment means it just hides you. Cover & Concealment is both - a good deal.

The maryjane is just good to hide in.

OK wait got the words wrong, ... this is an important concept or will be in the US when we do "the Yugoslavia" so learn this good.....

Cover - protects you against bullets
Concealment - hides you

Cover & Concealment - does both.

Here's an interesting and well-written article, "Beyond corn: Ethanol's next generation", in today's Chicago Tribune that delves into current cellulosic ethanol research.

That's a good read. There are lots of things in there to pay special attention to, especially for those who think cellulosic ethanol is just a matter of time. Maybe, maybe not. But one thing it is not is a sure thing:

"It's the holy grail ... if you can make it work," said John Felmy, chief economist at the American Petroleum Institute.

The question is, can you really make it work?

On a sun-baked plateau in Golden, Colo., scientists at the Department of Energy's National Renewable Energy Laboratory have been working on that question for three decades. James McMillan, a top biochemical engineer at the lab, said the outlook has never been brighter.

Looming stubbornly in front of researchers is a masterpiece of evolution: the rigid cell walls that give plants their strength and resiliency. Developed over the eons, these walls allow a slender stalk of prairie grass to bend like a ballerina in the wind yet snap back to attention to fend off cold, heat and pestilence. They help explain why a field of corn can grow over a man's head in a matter of a few short months.

The problem is, breaking down those walls is like robbing a bank. While the starch in corn kernels gives up its energy-packed sugars easily, the sugars in plant cell walls are locked into winding structures of complex carbohydrates designed to give plants backbone and protection.

My next essay is going to delve into this issue a bit, and contrast it with biomass gasification - a much better process, in my opinion. I will also point out that lately a number of ethanol advocates have taken to calling their biomass gasification processes "cellulosic ethanol", for reasons that are not completely clear to me.

RR
I'd be very interested in your opinion on this story about two UNL professors studying the use of sweet sorghum as the raw material for future ethanol production.  

 Sweet sorghum's advantages over Nebraska corn are many, he said.
  It doesn't need to be irrigated and goes into dormancy during drought periods.  The ratio of energy produced to energy consumed is much higher than corn, and an acre of sweet sorghum can produce as much as 800 gallons of ethanol.
  Corn's ethanol yield is closer to 250 gallons per acre.

What I like about this is that it is originating academically, not corporate or venture capitalistically.  

I'd be very interested in your opinion on this story about two UNL professors studying the use of sweet sorghum as the raw material for future ethanol production.

There are quite a few things with better yields than corn, but most have some other handling or capital issues. Don't know much about sorghum, but I don know that is the case with wheat.

"Cellulosic ethanol" is the new buzzword.  "Biomass gasification" sounds vaguely like breaking wind.
I have been a fan of Dr. Tom Reed and his research into gasification. I think it could be a significant silver BB.
Gassification is even more interesting as it can be low tech, kills pathogins/insect larve, and the resulting biochar can make the soil into Terra Preta.  

(400 PSI containers is a tad engineering overkill when all yas need is a metal container.)

US to Hold Naval Exercises in the Gulf

... A senior US official insisted the exercise is not aimed specifically at Iran...

The exercise, set for October 31, is the 25th to be organised under the US-led 66-member Proliferation Security Initiative and the first to be based in the Gulf near Bahrain, across from Iran, the officials said...

"It's an effort to bring a lot of Gulf states together to demonstrate resolve and readiness to act against proliferation," said the official, speaking on condition of anonymity.

The Proliferation Security Initiative, established in 2003 under President George W. Bush, is a voluntary association of countries that agree to share intelligence information and work against the proliferation of weapons of mass destruction, including through military exercises that practise interdiction techniques and coordination...

http://www.gulfnews.com/region/Bahrain/10074440.html

Well lets hope Bush holds back until the UK Gov listens to its New CGS:

http://timesonline.typepad.com/mick_smith/2006/10/at_last_a_comma.html

And here is what the  British Army thinks:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-2402666,00.html

...and here is the original Daily Mail scoop.

Worth a read (unless your name is Blair or Bush)

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=410163&in_page_id=17 70&ico=Homepage&icl=TabModule&icc=NEWS&ct=5

This puppy will run :)

He already "softened" his stance.

And all was quiet again.

He later told the BBC Radio 4 Today programme that when he talked about pulling out of Iraq "sometime soon", he meant "then when the mission is substantially done we should leave".

"We don't want to be there another two, three, four, five years. We've got to think about this in terms of a reasonable length of time."

He said the view that the presence of UK troops "exacerbates" the problems was "not right across the country", but in parts of it.

And he later said in a statement: "I'm a soldier - we don't do surrender, we don't pull down white flags. We will remain in southern Iraq until the job is done - we're going to see this through."

'Still needed'

Downing Street queried the way the chief of the General Staff's original statements, in the Daily Mail, were presented.

A spokesman said Sir Richard was "actually saying what government policy is.

"We don't want to be there any longer than we have to, but ultimately that is a decision for the Iraqi government."

Roel, I think this puppy will run. It is unprecedented (AFAIK) that the CGS would give such a public airing. Strange that it wasnt the Times or Telegraph, but the Mail has a larger readership. Blair has no choice but to allign with and try to contain the CGS. Blair is a lame duck and dare not fire the man. Where the CGS goes, others will feel confident to follow. There will be more.

Was this a warning to the next UK Prime-Minister?

Bad week for BushCo though, 600K + Iraqi dead (maybe)and the CGS of his major partner in the 'coalition of the willing' wanting to get out.

I assume Faux will cover this fairly and in depth?

Bad week for Bush?

How about a particularly bad few years for 600K+ Iraqis?  

That, regrettably is a given. Every week is a bad week for Iraqis.

Apparently the death toll is only half the story. About 40 thousand Iraqis are heading out per month. The kind of Iraqis you need: Engineers, Doctors,Teachers, and yes... Dare I say Lawyers. - The kind of people it takes to build a shattered nation.

BTW: From today's papers, looks like the CGS of UKMil is safe: Nobody dare sack him, least of all B'Liar.

(Will you do us a big favour? When this fart of a man finally fucks off, can you put him on the rubber chicken lecture circuit in the US? Lectures entitled: ''I did it my way, if George said it was ok'' should go down well),  -and he can pick up his pretty medal from congress as well

British Generals and Admirals have had issues with knaves, rats and politicos before but what happend on Friday is unprecedented. A lot of politicos, past and present have objected to the CGS's input. I wonder why?

Home before Christmas? Maybe Christmas 2007. Hope so. This whole Iraqi thing is without doubt the most disgusting atrocity on a nation ever committed by the US and UK in 200 years. And all done in our name by scum not fit to run a whelk stall let alone nations of quality of thought and deed.

The term Pandora's Box springs to mind, but I suppose the semi-literate NeoNaziCons would not have a clue. And anyway, Pandora isnt in the Bible so it cant be true.

About the time we thought Rabbit Skin Loin Cloths were fashionable, the peoples of Mesopotamia were baking the brilliant blue tiles of the Ishtar Gate, building in stone, evolving writing, mathematics and astronomy.

But hey! an Abrahms tank shell trumps all right?

End of Rant.

Waddya mean bad week for Bush?

The Dow set another record today...and crude is under $60.  And he's tough on terrorism you know...that is all I need to be happy in this world.

Funny how the bankers are standing by the rebuild Lebanon after Isreal just got done blowing it all up.  Wonderful GDP boost!

http://www.menafn.com/qn_news_story_s.asp?storyid=1093129081

After seeing this same mis-spelling dozens of times on TOD, I have to finally nitpick: It's spelled "Israel".
touchee.  hehe
I thought the Plan C post article was interesting, and optimistic.

Nice to see that it hit the theme I've shared, of happiness and not GDP, or ever-higher energy consumption.

Glad to see and read that you are on the happiness bandwagon!  What a novel concept :)  

These community solutions people I think have the right ideas.  They need to team up with the people working on the physical design of settlements and infrastructure.  If everyone with a lawn grows vegetables, where would they sell them?  This relates to the thread a few days ago about establishing public squares and markets and a walkable downtown.  

They won't sell the veggies, they'll eat them.  If you think you can grow more veggies than you'd eat, in your spare time on a suburban plot, then you havn't tried it.
I have a garden, i know how hard it is and what my yields are.  But, I generally grow more of one thing than I want and nothing of other stuff that I would like.  Sometimes just next door, I'll bring some tomatoes over.  Later, they might bring me some of their brussel sprouts.  For it to really work well, it would be helpful to have more people involved, with even other types of stuff.  This could be conviently done in our more centrally located market.  It's called trading, or if money is used as an intermediate exchange medium, you could call it commerce.  
No one wants my Okra until I distill it...
I've never trusted Okra from reputation and, after seeing a guy eat it, ewwwww the slime! But, the sell it in the Asian markets so someone has come up with a delicious way to cook it (Asians have worked out how to cook anything and make it delicious) so, I may have to look into this odd little vegetable...

I am moving about a mile from here, and will have some ability to garden in pots, and I think do some "guerilla gardening" nearby - if only not easily identifiable stuff like sweet pototoes, okra, nettles, etc.

There is already a delicious way to cook okra, you deep fry it in cornbread batter. It is then absolutely delicious.
This man speaks the truth.

You can also stew it with tomatoes and onions, or make gumbo.  All are wonderful.  Also, since okra is viable up to 105F, everyone should get comfortable with it now.  If the temperatures keep rising, it'll be a feature in many gardens in the years to come.

I prefer okra stewed, or better yet in gumbo :-))

Harvest them every couple of days.  When the pods get too big
(say more than 2.5 inches long) they get "woody".  Quite productive

Good Eating,

Alan

Odo: I am sure that you have noticed that the basis for all advertising (which is endemic in the American culture) is that you cannot be happy without whatever crap du jour they are pushing.
it is an obvious catch-22 that no one wants to advertise nothing ;-)
Well, advertising started out saying in objective terms why your product was better than the competitors, usually for products that people actually 'needed'.  Now, mostly they appeal to more fundamental or baser desires such as survival, acceptance, domination and often for products that are very optional.  

I particularly like the Hummer ads like the one where the timid lady is at the playground and a rude kid cuts in front of hers at the slide and she say to the rude kids mother 'johnny was next' and the even ruder rude kids mother says 'not any more'.  At that moment the timid mother sees a Hummer addvertisement on the side of a bus and the scene cuts to a dealer's showroom with the salesman handing over to the timid lady the keys to a Hummer.  Next you see her behind the wheel of that monster with a big, slightly wicked smile on her face (probably looking for the rude kids mother to roll over).  

i funny moment for me was when i saw a magazine called 'real simple' at the library.  i guess it shouldn't have been a shock to see that they tell you what you need to buy, to live simply.

but naturally a 'real-real simple' would not inspire advertisers.

Yeah I've seen "real simple" too, it's a thick glossy mag that's almost everywhere in the Bay Area and the ppl here step out of their Hummers to buy it without an inkling of the irony.

There was a Simple Living I think, or something like that - all these mags are glossies, full of adverts for crap.

If you want to get the real essence of non-consumerist living, you have to hang with the last of the Depression kids at the local VFW or Senior Center.

The catch-22 is a lot deeper: that is why the economy will crash for lack of cheap energy.  One person's "crap" is nother person's livelihood.  In the USA, about a half-million people work in the postal service, and the vast majority of mail these days is "junk" (unsolicited advertisements).  That's just the people who deliver it.  Now count the people who design the mailings (and TV ads and newspaper ads and internet ads...), those who print them, etc etc.  Then could those who make or sell or ship the crap, etc etc etc.  Like WT says, most Americans live on the discretionary income of other Americans.  All enabled by cheap energy (which enables cheap food).
that is the arc of doomer thought.  we are all terrible creatures, destined to death and collapse, and would have met our deserved ends long ago ... were it not for the historical accident of cheap energy.

darn that cheap energy!

I don't think that's quite accurate.  Cheap energy enabled the ecological overshoot that doomers claim so when that is gone comes the collapse.  I don't know where I am on the doomer scale, it varies daily, but I do think that anyone who pins this silliness only on our species is a speciest (like a racist).  

Ants do the exact same thing.  Drop a 5lb bag of sugar near an ant colony and before long, the colony has grown and expanded due to the good life brought on by this cheap energy source.  After the suger is gone they start eating each other or attacking other ant colonies to take their stash.  

It's just the way the world works.  

 

i was apiring to be irracible!

if i must be reasonable, i'd say that we can't just speak in grand arcs and generalizations.  when is energy "cheap" and when does that "end?"  the devil is in the details.

to say it must end someday, and that the people alive then will be unprepared, is a bit of a reach.  an optimist could answer otherwise, with as little grounding in fundimentals.

Energy is "cheap" if the EROI is high, say 10 or more.  The evidence is that what we'll have left in 10 or 20 years will be much worse.  E.g., even if the ethanol promoters are right, and it has a net energy gain, the EROI of 1.3 or so is pitiful, and will not maintain the "party".
the hirsch report, etc., point to a pretty significant oil production 10 or 20 years from now.

down, but not out.

"that is the arc of doomer thought."

I think it would be more correct to say "that is the cornucopian oversimplification of the arc of doomer thought."

In other words, please don't try to use a single brush stroke to characterize all of us who either don't believe our society/economy/lives will continue on the same path as we are currently on.

actually, i'll be just as critical of a cornucopian, if you can get one to show up here.

in the meantime, tod seems to draw another sort ...

BTW, vtpeaknik has responded twice in two days with a flat certainty of economic crash.  I believe he means a near term economic crash.

Do you share that, or do you think I might be speaking to a more extreme player in his case?

I'm not sure what vt believes, nor do I really know the full scope of his accussed doomerism (did I just coin a new word?).

Personally, I think there's a pretty good chance that we'll see a retraction starting in the next few months. Will this be THE crash? I doubt it since I don't believe in a single crash. By best guess at this point would be a series of recessions/depressions played out over decades, each one ending with a "recovery" to a lower economic standard of living.

But, that's not really my point. There are all sorts of different ideas about our future that get called "doomer" here. Some appear to me to be pure nonsense, others seem insightful. They may appear differently to ithers. Still, to paint them all as the same in some sense, especially in reference to the thought processes behind them, does a disservice to our efforts to have meaningful discussions here.

So, if you want to make fun of some conspiracy theory post that claims a coming inevitable global financial collapse - that's fine. But please don't lump me in with that, because I'm coming from a different place.

Just as you reacted negatively to my suggestion that you were a cornucopian (something I was counting on when I wrote it), others will react to your labelling them in the same way. So please be aware that, even among those who wear the label proudly (of which I am not one), there are many flavors of doomerism (there's that word again).

is the problem that you self-identify with an extreme, without sharing that extreme's values?
I simply am a long time student of politics and society. The only problem in this area that I have is with people who generalize too much. I suppose you think your response was clever, but what I read in it is a form of closed-mindedness. You seem to think that all forms of collapse thinking are the same. This is kind of like saying that all <fill in the blank> people are the same (and you know how they are, wink, wink).

So when you're done thinking that you have the correct answer and wish to actually discuss what makes some of us think that  a collapse is coming (and what that collapse might look like), I'll be here, and so will some others. You might find we can actually have a pretty good discussion.

Here's an idea. Ask a couple doomers exactly what is collapsing - and make them be specific. I've said this before here, what I believe we are seeing is the collapse of western civilization. If you'd like, I can go into more detail.

acutally, my thought was "what can I say to this guy?"

He says our society will crash, and goes on to explaint that it's the junk mail and etc:

The catch-22 is a lot deeper: that is why the economy will crash for lack of cheap energy.  One person's "crap" is nother person's livelihood.  In the USA, about a half-million people work in the postal service, and the vast majority of mail these days is "junk" (unsolicited advertisements).  That's just the people who deliver it.  Now count the people who design the mailings (and TV ads and newspaper ads and internet ads...), those who print them, etc etc.  Then could those who make or sell or ship the crap, etc etc etc.  Like WT says, most Americans live on the discretionary income of other Americans.  All enabled by cheap energy (which enables cheap food).

I think you hung your response to me off the wrong thread, buddy.

I think my response was appropriate to the "doomer arc" in the above.

Sorry of this is late - I've been out all day contributing to the coming collapse ;-). You can ignore it if you like.

But I will admit, that you can be a rather frustrating fellow. You can appear to be quite bright in one post and almost intentionally dense in the next.

I was specifically asking you to be a litte more open minded about the wide variety of collapse theories. Certainly I agree with you that a collapse theory based on junk mail is not worth much. But you keep wanting to take the step of condemning all collapse theories because some are "out there."

I think my brain does work better on some days than others .. that too contributes to my self-doubt
BTW, I have asked a few nuts and bolts questions, things that I need to support "collapse" from my pedantic position.

The cornerstone question IMO is "where is your oil depletion rate?"

If this is a "peak oil" thing, and not a general philosophy (or a value-group gathered around a philosophy), you'll be able to tell me when the shorfall hits, and why the remaining energy sources are not sufficient to support a technological society.

Here's an idea. Ask a couple doomers exactly what is collapsing - and make them be specific.

He has, but I don't think he really understood the answers.  Either he wasn't really trying, or it's so outside his frame of reference he just couldn't wrap his brain around it.

I picked up "The Happiness Hypothesis" (referenced indirectly, earlier) from the local library.  I've only gone few pages, but these lines registered:

[...] The second idea is Shakespeare's, about how "thinking makes it so."  (Or, as Buddha said, "Our life is the creation of our mind."  But we can improve on this ancient idea today by explaining why most people's minds have a bias toward seeing threats and engaging in useless worry.  We can do something to change this bias by using three techniques that increase happiness, one ancient and two very new.

I guess that all comes out in the was as ... is it just me?

Or have the relatively few "doomers" in our society really found the threat and worry that the rest of us cannot see?

Pick up "The Road" at the library or the local bookstore. It will take you six hours to read. Maybe less maybe more. It raises important questions.

If don't you believe me. Look it up on Amazon. After reading the book within 36 hours of hearing of it, the reviews on Amazon were the only fix I could get. This book is not for kids and it is definitely not a Christmas present for anybody but your closest friends and family.

The Road has 22 holds on it at the local library.  Popular.

FWIW, I'll quote the earlier reference, from the Happiness and Public Policy blog:

I've just received Jonathan Haidt's The Happiness Hypothesis and so far it is the best "how to be happy" book I've come across. Good combination of classical wisdom, current research, and good sense. For those who don't know of him, Haidt is a first-rate social psychologist at UVA who works on moral emotion and cognition.

We are all near-monkeys, with only imperfect machinery for rational thought.  None of us gets off the hook here.

That's why I love you, Odo. You gotta sense of humour and you're smart, too. "The Road" isn't a happy-feel-good book. I wonder why everybody's rushing out to buy it. It sells a lie in a most unpalatable form. Sheeple? The Hoi Polloi? Mind you, I wuz one of the first to read it.

And I always get off the hook.

Oh, wait. Those hooks that Hitler hung those guys on that tried to assassinate him. How big were they? This raises interesting questions.

What do Hugo Chavez' torture prisons look like? Does the ICRC get access to them, too?

Saw III comes out on Halloween.

Like I said...I don't think you have any understanding of so-called "doomers."  Who they are, why they think the way they do, etc.

Doomers, IME, are not necessarily less happy or more anxious than others.  If anything, it's "cornucopians" and "moderates" who are unhappy and anxious.  On some level, they are worried, or they wouldn't come here.  There's a certain peace that comes with accepting the worst.  And if it doesn't come to pass, it's a happy surprise.

I think you missed the key there.  I'm interested in the happiness thing because it relates to the "treadmill" of modern consumer society.  That in turn relates to the "growth" discussions we've had in the past (the extent to which growth should be properly measured as GDP, etc.).  Most of us here have tied those consumer/treadmill/happiness ideas to oil at one point or another.

But the "hook" above is not really the happiness itself, but where it fits in broader ideas of human rationality.  IIRC, some of us here have read Antonion Damasio's "Descare's Error" and recommended it here.  The "happiness" book is in that line (and carries a jacket recommendation from Damasio).  It is another well-recommended book about how our brains

And I quoted it in response to the bit where you of me "he couldn't wrap his brain around it."

That's right, and that's why I quoted the bits about "Our life is the creation of our mind" and " most people's minds have a bias toward seeing threats and engaging in useless worry."

Why couldn't I "wrap my brain" ... that's the big question.

I think my core position of uncertainty and moderation is based on a self-knowledge of my imperfect ability to foretell the future by "rational" means.

We suffer from an asymmetrical discussion in that sense.  People more convinced than me are asking me (a) to believe in their conviction, and (b) to believe in their conclusion.  All this of course while equally convinced people suggest quite different conclusions.

From this side of the scanner...it's not at all asymmetrical.  

FWIW, I'm not asking you to believe anything.  I'm interested in what other people believe, but I don't really care about changing it.  Any more than I'd try to change someone's religion.  (I always hated missionaries.)

This might be a rich vein to mine ... if we have the fortitude.

Explain "collapse" to the general population, and X percent will come back believing it.  To make a risky monkey prediction, I'd say that for large values of X that tells us something about society ... but for small values of X, it might tell us more about the distribution of human psychology and outlook.

I close, as I really should more often, with the excellent and ancient USENET acronym: YMMV.

Sinerum scopuli.
Sirenum duh.