Wave/Geothermal - Energy Return on Investment (EROI) (Part 6 of 6)
Posted by Nate Hagens on May 14, 2008 - 10:00am
Topic: Alternative energy
Tags: Charles Hall, eroei, eroi, geothermal, geothermal energy, net energy, wave, wave energy [list all tags]
This is the final piece of a series on Energy Return on Investment from Professor Charles Hall's EROI Workshop at SUNY. Today's papers outline the energy technologies of wave and geothermal power, concluding a 5 part series that has looked at Why EROI Matters, Natural Gas and Imported Oil, Tar Sands and Shale Oil, Nuclear Power, and Passive Solar, Photovoltaic, Wind, and Hydro-electric. Previously, Professor Hall also wrote the thought provoking, At $100 Oil, What Can the Scientist Say to the Investor. Forget not about the simple 'balloon graph' below of EROI x Scale for fossil and renewable energy sources that this project is attempting to update with the help of theoildrum.com readership.

INTRODUCTION
by Charles A. S. Hall
Most of the energy sources that we use or might use are dependent directly or indirectly upon the sun. This includes wave energy which is derived from wind (e.g. the sun). Nuclear, geothermal and tidal energies are different in that they depend upon nuclear decay within the Earth or Earth’s materials or, in the case of tidal, the processes of celestial motions. The advantage of these energies are that they are truly immense. The main disadvantages are that they are, with a few exceptions, dilute and hence very difficult to extract energy from. Another issue is that for some forms (e.g. heat from the ground) high quality energy (electricity) must be invested to extract low quality energy (heat), which can be a losing proposition even if the direct EROIs are positive. These issues for many situations imply generally low EROIs and hence low profitability. On the other hand some hot steam procedures in very favorable sites have high EROI and generate high quality electricity via investment of general engineering and materials, which implies lower quality investment energy. So unless these most favorable circumstances can be applied more generally or better methods are derived it is likely that development will be quite slow. On the other hand if and as EROIs from other fuels continue to decline they might be increasingly attractive. Tidal energies are likewise potentially enormous but there are few operational plants and we have not examined them. Daniel Halloran summarizes here such information as he could find on EROIs of various geothermal and wave energies. They are interesting but remain more as potential than realized energy and appear unlikely to effect our energy situation significantly for decades, if ever. As usual we seek your critiques and, especially, other hard literature that we missed.
APPENDIX H.
GEOTHERMAL ENERGY SUMMARY
Daniel Halloran SUNY-Syracuse
Definition: Geothermal energy is the heat within the earth, which can be “mined” by extracting hot water or steam, either to run a turbine for the generation of electricity or for direct use of the heat itself (Brown and Garnish 2004; Dickson and Fanelli 2005).
Resource Base
Theoretical: The heat content of the earth has been estimated to be about 13 trillion EJ (Dickson and Fanelli 2005). That heat comes from radioactive decay inside the Earth. Obviously, most of this is not practical to exploit.
The 2000 World Energy Assessment estimates that “140 million EJ per year” could theoretically be tapped within a depth of 5 kilometres”, with 5,000 EJ/yr being economical within 50 years (UNDP 2000). A recent MIT study estimated a stored thermal energy of 14 million EJ between 3 and 10 kilometers (Tester et al 2006). This energy could be tapped with enhanced geothermal systems (EGS), also known as Hot Dry Rock (HDR), which exploits the heat available at greater depths in the absence of groundwater.
Geopressured-geothermal systems could theoretically provide thermal energy from hot brine, mechanical energy from highly pressured fluid, and chemical energy from confined methane. The Gulf Coast of the United States has an estimated stored thermal energy of 11,600 EJ in geopressured sedimentary basins (John et al. 2006).
There is not a consensus in the literature regarding resource base estimates.
Actual: World-wide capacity for direct use of geothermal heat is about 16-17,000 MWt and world-wide installed capacity of geothermal electricity generation is about 9,000 MWe. Currently, the only places being exploited for geothermal power generation are places where hydrothermal resources exist. In a hydrothermal resource, heat is transferred to groundwater at depths penetrable by drilling technology. No power is generated commercially using HDR. The world leader in geothermal electricity is the United States with a capacity of over 2800 MWe, which accounts for 0.36% of U.S. electricity production (GEA 2007). Growth of geothermal power capacity worldwide has slowed from 9% per year in 1997 (EERE 1997) to 2.5% per year in 2004 (Dickson and Fanelli 2005).
Geothermal heat pumps, which extract heat from the normally “warm” shallow soils or their water, have grown to over a million units world-wide, led by the U.S. with 600,000 (Lund et al 2004), accounting for most of the four-fold increase in direct use capacity between 1992 and 2000 (Brown and Garnish 2004). While the heat pump industry has continued to grow, total geothermal direct use has slowed to 6 or 7% growth (Bronicki and Lax 2004). Total use of geothermal energy world-wide was an estimated 2 EJ in 2000 (Sawin 2004). Geothermal heat is regional in availability. Countries such as Iceland, Japan, the Philippines, Costa Rica, and the United States, have successfully exploited the shallow geothermal energy available at plate boundaries (Huttrer 2001). Most of the terrestrial Earth does not have those conditions.
Although in theory ground heat is indefinitely renewable there is concern about the sustainability of geothermal systems. Technically, geothermal resources are not renewable, because heat is always removed faster than it is replenished by the heat source (Brown and Garnish 2004; Lee 2004). The most important US site is The Geysers in California which has shown signs of cooling with heavy use. Nevertheless, geothermal energy sources are constant and require no storage other than the earth.
Technology: The general technology is that of steam turbine power generation, with rare “dry-steam” reservoirs (vapor-dominated) being the ideal type of resource. Because most resources are not dry steam, technological improvements are necessary for the geothermal industry to continue to grow (Brown and Garnish 2004), possibly including improvements in enhanced geothermal systems.
EROI
The EROI for electricity generation from hydrothermal resources has been reported by a handful of researchers with a range of 2.0 to 13.0 (Table 1). Some conceptual EROI values have been calculated for HDR ranging from 1.9 to 39.0, and for geopressured systems with a range of 2.9 to 17.6. The ranges represent the lack of a unified methodology for EROI analysis and disagreements about system boundaries, quality-correction, and future expectations. No EROI values of geothermal direct use were found. Because they exploit and use lower-temperature resources rather than electricity generation, and are more universally applied, it is probably safe to assume higher EROI values for most direct use applications.
Economics
In addition to geography and technology, high capital cost and low fossil fuel costs are major limiting factors for geothermal development, especially for HDR and geopressured systems which are still in the developmental phases. A kilowatt-hour of electricity generated at The Geysers, the largest field in California, sells for 3-3.5¢, and many other plants are economically competitive at about 9¢ (MDEQ 2007). Economic feasibility could be potentially improved in the U.S. with an extension of the Production Tax Credit (Gawell 2007) and with cascading geothermal systems, which use lower temperature waste fluids in succession for secondary applications (Lee 2004).
Environmental and Social Impacts
Positives: Reduced emissions and low land area compared to fossil fuel plants, employment benefits, decreased dependence on foreign energy for countries rich in geothermal resources (EERE, No Date).
Negatives: Small danger of air, water, thermal, and noise pollution, erosion and solid waste buildup. Subsidence, hydrothermal eruptions, aesthetic disruptions, local or indigenous objection, and changes of surface manifestations are rare and site-specific. There is also a controversial possibility of induced seismicity.
Prospects: The limited hydrothermal resources are unlikely to become a silver bullet solution to meet increasing global energy needs but could continue to be important regionally. If HDR were to become economically feasible, much larger, less-depletable geothermal resources would be opened up worldwide, potentially increasing EROI, geographic relevance, and long-term sustainability of geothermal power, with an estimated increase in production of a factor of ten or more (Tester 2006). Geothermal heat pumps already seem to be generating net thermal energy on small scales and are nearly limitless geographically.
Table 1. Geothermal Power EROI
Bibliography
Bronicki, L., Lax, M., 2004. Geothermal energy, In: World Energy Council, 2004. Survey of Energy Resources, Elsevier Inc. http://www.worldenergy.org/wec-geis/publications/reports/ser04/overview....
Brown, G., Garnish, J., 2004. Geothermal energy, In: Boyle, G. (Ed.), 2004. Renewable Energy, Power for a Sustainable Future, Oxford University Press.
Carson and Underhill, 1976. [I don’t see this referenced in this summary paper. It refers to a paper referenced in Herendeen and Plant for which I found no other info. See Table 2 of my larger paper--DH]
Cleveland, C.J., Costanza, R., Hall, C.A.S., Kaufmann, R. 1984. Energy and the U.S. economy: a biophysical perspective. Science 225, 890-897.
Dickson, M.H., Fanelli, M. (Ed.), 2005. Geothermal Energy, Utilization and Technology. Earthscan, London. 205 pp.
Geothermal Energy Association (GEA) website, 2007. http://www.geo-energy.org.
Gilliland, M.W., 1975. Energy analysis and public policy. Science 189(4208), 1051-1056.
Halloran, 2007. Unpublished [this refers to my own EROI calculations, which are shown on Table 3 of my larger paper.]
Herendeen, R.A., Plant, R.L., 1981. Energy analysis of four geothermal technologies. Energy 6, 73-82.
Huttrer, G.W., 2001. The status of world geothermal power generation 1995-2000. Geothermics 30(2001), 1-27.
Icerman, L., 1980. Net energy production history of the geysers geothermal project. Energy 5, 29-33.
International Geothermal Association (IGA), 2001. Report of the IGA to the UN commission on sustainable development, session 9 (CSD-9), New York, April 2001. http://iga.igg.cnr.it/geo/geoenergy.php
Lee, K.C., 2004. Geothermal power generation, In: Cleveland, C.J. (Ed.), 2004. Encyclopedia of Energy, Elsevier Inc.
Lund, J., Sanner, B., Rybach, L., Curtis,R., Hellström, G., 2004. Geothermal (Ground Source) Heat Pumps – A World Overview. http://geoheat.oit.edu/bulletin/bull25-3/art1.pdf
Muffler, L.J.P (Ed.), 1979. United States Geological Survey Circular 790: Assessment of Geothermal Resources of the United States – 1978.
Murphy, H., Drake, R., Tester, J., Zyvoloski, G., 1985. Economics of a conceptual 75 MW hot dry rock geothermal electric power-station. Geothermics 14 (2-3), 459-474.
Odum, H. T., C. Kylstra, J. Alexander, N. Sipe, P. Lem, M. Brown, S. Brown, M. Kemp, M. Sell, W. Mitsch, E. DeBellevue, T. Ballentine, T. Fontaine, S. Bayley, J. Zucchetto, R. Costanza, G. Gardner, T. Dolan, A. March, W. Boynton, M. Gilliland, and D. Young. 1976. Net Energy Analysis of Alternatives for the United States. pp. 254-304. In: Middle and Long-Term Energy Policies and Alternatives. 94th Congress 2nd Session Committee Print. Prepared for the Subcommittee on Energy and Power of the Committee on Interstate and Foreign Commerce of the U.S. House of Representatives. Serial No. 94-63. U.S. Gov. Printing Office.
Petty, S., Porro, G, 2006. Updated U.S. Geothermal Supply Characterization. Conference Paper NREL/CP-640-41073, March 2007. Available online at http://www.osti.gov/bridge.
Sanyal, S.K., Morrow, J.W., Butler, S.J., Robertson-Tait, A., 2007. Cost of Electricity from Enhanced Geothermal Systems. Proceedings, 32nd Workshop on Geothermal Reservoir Engineering.
Tester, J.W., Anderson, B.J., Batchelor, A.S., Blackwell, D.D., DiPippo, R., Drake, E.M., Garnish, J., Livesay, B., Moore, M.C., Nichols, K., Petty, S., Toksoz, M.N., Veatch, R.W., 2006. The Future of Geothermal Energy – Impact of Enhanced Geothermal Systems (EGS) on the United States in the 21st Century. An assessment by an MIT-led interdisciplinary panel. Available online at http://geothermal.inel.gov.
United Nations Development Programme (UNDP), 2000. World Energy Assessment.
APPENDIX I.
WAVE ENERGY: Potential, EROI, and Social and Environmental Impacts
Daniel Halloran, SUNY-ESF, Syracuse NY
INTRODUCTION
Wave energy is solar energy concentrated by the wind (Thorpe 2004), which can be converted into mechanical energy for the generation of electricity. Wave energy has been a part of the renewable energy discussion since the 1970s (Duckers 2004), but has yet to materialize as a viable option for large-scale power generation. It can have a high power density (storm waves up to 1700 kW per meter of wave crest length) depending on the speed, duration, and fetch (unimpeded distance over water) of the wind (Duckers 2004). Because of this high power density, and more recently, its relatively low environmental impact, wave energy research and development continues in many countries, most notably the UK, Japan, Norway, and Portugal (Thorpe 2004).
HISTORY
During the energy shocks of the 1970s, wave energy research was mainly government funded and academic in nature. After tapering off for a few decades, it is beginning to reemerge, this time led by small engineering companies (Thorpe 2004).
RESOURCE BASE AND USE
The wave energy resource base is highly regional in potential. Estimates of the global potential vary widely for reasons that we do not know (Table 1) but many agree that there is a significant exploitable energy source in the waves, especially between 30 and 60 degrees latitude. Wave intensity at these latitudes is greatest in the winter, corresponding with the seasonal peak in electricity demand (Lemonis 2004). Tropical regions have some potential because of the prevailing steady trade winds, but power densities are generally not as high (Thorpe 2004). As with most “environmental” energies a large problem is that the supplies cannot be counted upon, but is at least partially intermittent.

Table 1. Global Resource Base Estimates: Wave Power
Regional differences in the direction, duration, and fetch of wind across the ocean combined with differences in ocean depths near shore cause certain areas to have greater wave power densities than others. Greater wave power densities (or levels) are more feasibly converted into useful mechanical energy. The illustration below shows the semi-latitudinal pattern of wave power density.

Presently, there is very little wave power being generated anywhere in the world. Recently, a Pelamis off-shore unit developed by the Scottish firm Ocean Power Delivery (OPD) was deployed off the coast of Portugal with a grid-connected capacity of 2.25 MW (Power tech 2007). This installment approximately doubled the previous worldwide capacity of about 2 MW that had existed in demonstration projects (Table 1).
There is significant wave potential in the Northeastern Pacific, and the State of Oregon has begun looking into options for exploiting it using technology developed at Oregon State University (Profita 2007). The United States is well behind Europe and Japan, despite estimates that the U.S. wave potential is twice that of Japan and nearly five times that of Great Britain (OEC 2006).
TECHNOLOGY
There are over 1000 patented techniques under development for converting wave energy into mechanical energy that can be used to generate electricity (Lemonis 2004). The challenge is the precise engineering required to enable a turbine or other moving part to move relative to the central structure (Duckers 2004). Because the physics of waves varies geographically and temporally, many technological solutions have been proposed, tested, and in few cases, implemented. They are generally classified according to their relative distances from shore.
EROI
Net energy analysis of wave energy appears to be non-existent. One study (Banjeree et al 2006) reports life cycle emissions of 21.67 g CO2 per kWh and energy payback time of just over one year for the Pelamis off shore device. Therefore, with an expected lifetime of 15 years per device, the Pelamis could be a sustainable net energy producer with an EROI of nearly 15:1. It is not known how much this would be reduced by including maintenance and other costs. This analysis does not account for the small scale of wave energy production and the inability to demonstrate significant commercial production to date.
ECONOMICS
There is optimism in the field about wave energy becoming economical in the near future (Duckers 2004; Margolis 2007), although the capital costs are very large. A kWh of wave energy costs about 20 to 30 cents to generate, but one expert compared the wave energy cost to that of wind 20 years ago (Profita 2007). Wind is now down to 4 to 6 cents per kWh. Reportedly, the best technology in the UK is producing at an average of 7.5 cents (OEC 2006). Although waves are more predictable than wind, the variability of the wind causes wave power stations to run at relatively low capacity factors, perhaps around 40% (Duckers 2004), compared to 95% or higher for geothermal energy, for example. This threatens the ability of production to pay back high costs. However, the capacity factor for wind power systems is lower than for wave energy, and the wind industry has been able to reduce costs significantly. In addition, waves are much more dense than moving air, meaning smaller turbines can generate the same amount of electricity (Profita 2007; Lemonis 2004). Smaller turbines should imply smaller cost. However, a major economic consideration is durability and plant lifetime, which may be greatest at near-shore pressure plants such as OWCs with fewer moving parts and less susceptibility to storm damage. In addition salt water implies a very difficult corrosion environment.
Overall there is little experience with wave energy and although the EROI appears moderately favorable the lack of experience and the irregular nature of the resource appears to have resulted in very little research. We have heard that there was one system built in Portugal that was destroyed by a storm but we cannot find a reference even from our Portuguese colleagues.
ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACTS
Positives: Little to no chemical pollution during operation and little to no land use (Lemonis 2004). These devices would have very low greenhouse gas emissions estimated at 11g of CO2 per kWh for near-shore schemes (Duckers 2004), and 21.67g per kWh for the off-shore Pelamis device (Banjeree et al 2006). This compares to a release of about xx KG of CO2 per kWh for coal-fired electricity production.
Negatives: These devices require very high construction costs. From a net energy perspective, the energy required to build the infrastructure may outweigh the small amount of electricity wave projects are capable of producing in the short term. Sever storms have dashed the hopes of some earlier projects, probably before serious energy has been returned. They may also alter coastlines by changing energetic patterns of waves (Lane 2007 may generate various environmental impacts, most of which are unknown. Other potential impacts, such as disruption of marine habitat and fish migration patterns, and sedimentation, are generally agreed to be minimal, but important considerations on an individual project basis.
SOCIAL IMPACTS
Noise pollution is usually low (Duckers 2004), but could be a problem in some situations (Thorpe 2004). There has been some concern about aesthetics (Lane 2007) and disruption of fishing, shipping, and boating (Lane 2007). These impacts would occur in both construction and operation.
PROSPECTS
Wave energy has yet to be demonstrated as a possibility for large-scale commercial power generation. However, with the rising costs of fossil fuels and increasing environmental concerns, a competitive wave industry, if developed, could be one of the most environmentally benign of the renewables. The most practical application for wave energy in the short to medium term could be on small, remote islands without easy access to fossil fuel shipments or the need for long transmission lines. The potential for these sorts of small but locally important projects seems highest in the UK, where wave power density is high and much of the research is centered. Ocean Power Delivery, the Scottish company that provided the 2.25 MW installation in Portugal, is planning a 3 MW project in Orkney, the small island systems off the north coast of Scotland (OPD 2007). There has also been research into potential uses for wave energy other than electricity, most notably desalinization and hydrogen generation.
References
Banjeree, S., Duckers, L.J., Blanchard, R., Choudhury, B.K., 2006. Life cycle analysis of selected solar and wave energy systems. Advances in Energy Research 2006. http://www.ese.iitb.ac.in/aer2006_files/papers/142.pdf
Duckers, L., 2004. Wave energy, In: Boyle, G. (Ed.), Renewable Energy: Power for a Sustainable Future. Oxford University Press.
European Thematic Network on Wave Energy (ETNWE), 2002. Wave energy utilization in Europe, current status and perspectives. Centre for Renewable Energy Sources.
European Wave Energy Network (EWEN), No Date. History of Wave Energy. http://www.wave-energy.net/Schools/History.htm
International Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), 2007. Working Group III "pre-copy edit" to the 4th Report, Climate Change 2007: Mitigation of Climate Change. http://www.mnp.nl/ipcc/pages_media/AR4-chapters.html
Margolis, J., 2007. Wave farms show energy potential. BBC news.com, March 2, 2007. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/6410839.stm
Lane, N., 2007. Issues affecting tidal, wave, and in-stream generation projects. CRS Report for Congress, May 2, 2007.
Lemonis, 2004. Wave and tidal energy conversion, In: Cleveland, C.J. (Ed.), 2004. Encyclopedia of Energy, Elsevier Inc.
Ocean Energy Council (OEC) Website, 2006. Wave Energy FAQ. http://oceanenergycouncil.com/faqwave.html
Ocean Power Delivery (OPD) Ltd Wesbsite, 2007. UK’s first wave project announced. http://www.oceanpd.com/default.html
Oxley, R., 2006. An overview of marine renewables in the UK: a synopsis of michael hay’s presentation. Ibis 148(s1), 203-205.
Power Technology, the Website for the Power Industry, 2007. Pelamis, World’s First Commercial Wave Energy Project, Agucadoura , Portugal. http://www.power-technology.com/projects/pelamis/
Thorpe, 2004. Wave energy, In: World Energy Council, 2004. Survey of Energy Resources. http://www.worldenergy.org/wec-geis/publications/reports/ser/overview.as...
United Nations Development Programme (UNDP), 2000. World Energy Assessment.
Wave-energy.net, 2007. History of Wave Energy. http://www.wave-energy.net/Schools/History.htm



For wave power the Wavehub project is very important, as it will test several different technologies and provide some real insight into costs:
http://media.cleantech.com/1800/uk-plugs-into-wave-hub
UK plugs into Wave Hub | Cleantech.com
Several different methods of power generation will be built there, and run their power ashore together.
Another widely available and relatively energy dense resource is ocean and tidal currents, which are attempting to be tapped using turbines:
http://www.treehugger.com/files/2007/12/gulf_streams_wave_energy.php
Gulf Stream's Tidal Energy Could Provide Up to a Third of Florida's Power (TreeHugger)
Further to the discussion of ground source heat pumps, it should be noted that CO2 air heat pumps are now able to operate to very low temperature levels, and are vastly more cost effective than ground source:
http://www.jarn.co.jp/News/2003_Q2/30620_Eco_Cute.htm
"Eco Cute" CO2 Heat Pump Water Heaters
If considered as part of a total heating package in conjunction with electricity sources, multiplying the heat value of the electricity by between a factor of 2.5 for existing buildings and up to 4 for new builds greatly raises the energy efficiency of that portion of the eletricity used for space heating, so polar PV, wind, nuclear and coal and gas would all operate at rather higher EROEI.
Another wave power demo plant:
http://www.inhabitat.com/2008/01/02/pge-takes-the-plunge-into-wave-power
PG&E is building a roughly 2MW wave power plant in northern California. Within a few years I think we will have a significant amount of data on the economics.
Is polar PV something new? :P
Is is not new, but they are expanding it greatly at the Antartic base, as it works very effectively in the summer when it is staffed and supplies power around the clock - the low temperatures help, too! :-)
Is gravitational collapse still considered an original source of geothermal energy?
http://www.imtechnologies.org/powerstations/geothermal_energy.php
Ground sourced heat pumps that use shallow buried pipes over a fairly large area (usually a cheaper option than deep vertical pipes if the land is available) are not geothermal devices. They cool the surface of the ground slightly and this tips the equilibrium between absorbed and re-radiated energy at the surface. The energy gain over the electrical input is thus a form of solar energy. The mean solar input per unit area of ground is about 10,000 times more than the geothermal energy coming up except in exceptional areas (like Iceland). Vertical pipes are solar dominated for the first 15 metres or so. Thereafter geothermal energy travelling radially in the surrounding area becomes the dominant source
The continuing flow of Geothermal energy has its origin in radioactive decay as the article states. Gravitational collapse stopped long ago and the heat generated by it would have long since leaked away.
I would dispute the air sourced heat pumps are a better option then ground sources ones if you have the ground to install one. Any advance in working fluids, thermodynamic cycles and heat exchangers will apply equally to both types. Even a slight drop in the external temperature makes a big hit on the coefficient of performance. The link given says they have achieved a COP of 3. This will be under the best conditions. It would be unlikely to achieve better than 2.3 over the winter. I have instrumented my ground source system and it achieved a COP of better than 4 for nearly all the winter.
For an annual 6000kWh heat input to the house that is an annual saving of about 1100kWh of electricity. The cost of the pipes and excavation for my system was about £1500. Subtract from that the cost of the air exchange unit and take a guess at how much electricity will rise over the next few years and it does not take that long to get your money back. In the UK where there is a a government grant of about £1500 available for ground sourced systems but not air sourced ones and there is no contest. In addition you do not have an ugly air exchange unit stuck on your house.
Wow! I have never seen a figure remotely near to £1500 for the pipes and excavation!
I am not disputing it, but have you a link to your supplier?
A rough estimate I got at a recent home show in Canada was about $30,000 for an average suburban house. Another estimate from a few years ago was $20,000. Needless to say, I'm concentrating on insulation first.
I was quoted €6500 euros for a complete ground source heat pump system here in Germany, if installed as part of a new house build [1] so I could imagine laying the piping being around 1500GBP. Fertighaus's are largely made of chipboard and vast quantities of expanded polystyrene. The walls are typically around 40cm thick and filled mostly with insulation. 0.1 -> 0.14 W/m^2K heat flow.
The crucial point being that it is part of a new build, much more expensive to retrofit to an existing property. Plus it comes down to supply and demand, if you're the only one in your state trying to install an HP system it's going to be pricey.
You may well find it's cheaper to knock an old property down and put something like a fertighaus up in it's place rather than trying to heat and maintain a traditional property over the next 25 years.
[1] Fertighaus: http://www.fertighaus.de/
Sounds like you could do this with ThermaSave products.
Small quibble - the heat from the original gravitational collapse may have leaked away but the heat from continued gravitational pull (collapse, except that things are fairly dense liquids or solids) continues in conjunction with radioactive decay. In fact, this mechanism has been presented as one possible theory of terrestrial heat generation. As the paper referenced notes, there are aspects of this theory that are more consistent with observed statistical values than the fully radiogenic theory. Further, work published in the journal "Nature" also calls into question the radiogenic theory.
Thus, I would state that it is far from settled that radiogenic sources are the only or even primary source of terrestrial geothermal heat.
I agree with Nick Rouse above.
Ground source heat pumps are only sold as 'geothermal' because it sounds good. Basically the heat comes from the air by making the ground a bit colder than it would have been otherwise.
Air source heat pumps have a problem of the heat exchanger becoming coated with ice in damp climates like the UK. This means that their midwinter performance deteriorates rather seriously and at worst they may have to revert to plain resistance heating. There was interest in them in the UK in the 1970s but, as I understand it, the electricity industry dumped the air source technology when they realised that it would not reduce the peak winter load on the grid.
Ground source heat pumps get round this by using the thermal mass of the ground to coast through midwinter cold periods without performance dropping too much.
You have to be careful in assigning an EROI to heat pumps. Most are electrically operated, so they are really part of the electricity distribution network rather than an actual energy source. A true EROI calculation needs to start with the EROI of the fuel used to generate the electricity. Their advantage is that they can compensate for the efficiency loss at the power station. If 3 units of coal go in to make 1 unit of electricity, then the heat pump with a COP of 3 can convert this back to 3 units of heat.
The same applies to engine-driven heat pumps. The Festival Hall in London was originally designed to use diesel driven heat pumps sucking heat from the Thames. I'd guess at a diesel to heat COP of around 1.5 for this, so the overall EROI would be the EROI of the diesel fuel multiplied by 1.5 less a bit for the energy used to make the diesel heat pump.
Finally can I ask again -
Where is the EROI of building insulation as a potential generator of negawatts (i.e energy not used)? Surely this is just as valid as positive energy flows in the bubble diagram?
I reckon it has potential EROIs in the range 10-100 and potential equivalent negawatt flows in the US of the order of 5 quads or more.
BobE
Bob, I referred to ground source heat pumps as geothermal because that is the commonly accepted term, not out of ignorance as to their source of heat.
On the issue of icing etc, that may well have been a problem in the 70's, as might inadequate performance, but it seems clear that the latest Japanese designs have overcome both, and have very good performance.
They are extensively used in the island of Hokkaido, where the winters are harsh and humidity is often high.
Not only is the source of geothermal heat the energy generated by the decay of uranium and thorium atoms within the earth, but that decay produces radioisotopes which pose certain radiation dangers that might be associated with the use of geothermal power. I became aware of this while investigating radiation problems associated with the extraction of natural gas from the Barnett Shale of North Texas. The extraction of heated steam and water from subsurfaces sources will inevitably bring radioisotopes including radium and radon to the surface. These isotopes in tern have the potential for contaminating geothermal electrical generating systems, as well as releasing significant amounts of radioactive gas into the atmosphere. Thus the use of geothermal energy sources pose a hazard to human health, it the associated release of radioisotopes is not contained and cleaned up.
Secondly, in practical terms earth source heat pumps are far more expensive to install than air source heat pumps. They are also potentially very expensive to repair. A COP of over 6 is possible with air source heat pumps, and air source heat pumps capable of operating in Canada have been designed. Air source heat pumps are far more practical replacements for gas furnaces in the American South, because of their lower price, and because Air Conditioning contractors would already be familiar with many air source heat pump features. An air source heat pump is basically an air conditioner that can reverse its heating and cooling cycle.
Because they tend to level summer-winter electrical demand, electrical generating companies might well subsidize the installation of air source heat pumps. The Government could also offer tax incentives for switching from natural gas to ASHPs.
I would dispute the air sourced heat pumps are a better option then ground sources ones if you have the ground to install one. Any advance in working fluids, thermodynamic cycles and heat exchangers will apply equally to both types. Even a slight drop in the external temperature makes a big hit on the coefficient of performance. The link given says they have achieved a COP of 3. This will be under the best conditions. It would be unlikely to achieve better than 2.3 over the winter. I have instrumented my ground source system and it achieved a COP of better than 4 for nearly all the winter.
Hi Nick,
I keep detailed and I like to think fairly accurate records of my heat pump's operation and its seasonal COP averages between 2.4 and 2.5 over the course of our long, cold and surprisingly damp winters (colder than Buffalo, NY and about as damp as the Pacific North West!). I've crossed checked these numbers with my fuel oil consumption and daily meter readings and everything seems to mesh well. My heat pump is an older model that falls below current federal standards; its HSPF is 7.2 and the new minimum is 7.7. High end air source units such as those offered by Fujitsu, with HSPF ratings as high as 11.0, are 1.5 times more energy efficient than my own and generate far more heat at the low-end of the temperature band and continue to operate down to -15C and I'm told, anecdotally, as low -20C. The COP in this case is as high as 3.2, which is not all that far off from that of a typical GSHP, particularly if heating and cooling loads are not well balanced and taking into consideration additional fan and pump related losses.
I paid $2,100.00 CDN for my ductless unit, installed -- a GSHP would easily cost ten to fifteen times as much (likely more since my home has no existing duct work) and would at best save me another couple hundred dollars on my utility costs. As it stand now, my home's space heating costs are about $650.00 a year (electric + backup oil) and a Fujitsu high efficiency model could knock another $150.00 off that. I'm trying hard to understand how a GSHP can offer better overall value in moderately cold climates like mine (well, that is if you consider Buffalo, NY moderately cold) and for the life of me I'm just not getting it. And I'm not saying this to be argumentative -- I genuinely want to know if they are truly cost effective and offer superior value when compared to the other alternatives.
Cheers,
Paul
The heat of formation of the Earth is considered a contributor to the heat flux from the Earth. Radiogenic heat is usually considered to be the larger contributor these days. Tidal heating also contributes.
Chris
Just look at the graph.
I love the prominence of the *C*O*A*L* big red spot hanging up high and in center.
Look at it. It's HUGE. It's Efficient. It's abundant.
It's here in the west. In US, Canada, Australia, Germany, Poland.
Please, try to find on that picture Gasahol, biodiesel, and Tar sands. This is not trick, it's there!
How much more does it have to hurt before US politicians stop fooling around with regulations on corn ethanol and Carbon Sequestration and run for this proven, cheap and abundant and All-American resource?
You might not like it, but you have to admit that in short term, there is no substitute, because we do not have 30-50 years do develop and scale up wind, solar, biomass and thermonuclear power Generation and (don't forget!) Storage.
Petrus;
I have trouble being roused into patriotic reveries over Coal, which is poisoning our air and water before, during and after it is used for maintaining our expectation of this energy-fat diet.
I don't deny that it is the most convenient source to turn towards.. but this thinking is dangerously short term as we look at Atmospheric Carbon, Mercury and other pollutants in the waterways as they become constantly more important for fish and other wildlife health (and their relationship to food supply)
You're right I don't like it, and yet I do not admit that there is no substitute. We've known about the substitutes for 30 years or more. The fact that we've basically ignored them so far doesn't suddenly make coal a reasonable option.
With any luck, we'll have enough unemployed Auto and Airline workers to finally initiate a new WPA equivalent.. and then we'd see how fast a PV/Wind/Conservation/Transit(etc,etc..) Buildout could really be effected.
Thanks for the patriotic remark, but that misses the point. This becomes a fight for survival, there is no time to be spoiled.
My point is that without coal, we do not have enough energy to replace 50 years of infrastructure before oil hits prohibitive $200/barrel. No matter how many workers you have, if you have no affordable energy, you have no steel, no pipes, no wires, no transportation and you cannot achieve anything.
Yes we did ignore substitutes too long.
Yes, oil is energy of a far better quality than coal.
But quality of energy from coal is still far better than biomass, wind, direct solar, and most of the rest.
As far as clean, I am burning coal and it far cleaner than wood. Good coal is smokeless. Biomass never is.
I am very enthusiastic over Underground Coal Gasification. That is even much cleaner, consumes nearly all coal underground and leaving all the ash and trash right in place. Clean syngas is then taken to surface for processing.
It is much less wasteful, more energy efficient, way cleaner, safer for miners, and the resulting syngas is ready for synthetic diesel or gasoline.
Seems we have a Coal industry lobbyist onboard...
Awesome! He can hang with the nuclear lobbyists and that guy who's always promoting the little carriages hanging from cables.
Well done. That was funny!
Seems we have a Coal industry lobbyist onboard...
Awsome. If this serves as the only remaining "argument", then that is a solid acknowledgement that the bare facts are undisputable. Thanks for contributing this important scientifc argument.
Be forewarned, that I am also Nuclear lobbyist, Polywell Fusion lobbyist, External Combustion Quasiturbine lobbyist and Everything That Makes Sense lobbyist. And I do all that lobbying for free!
On the other hand, I would not lobby for Carbon Sequestration of Corn Ethanol if you paid me a million bucks, because I think that it is gravely immoral to put lives of millions of people in misery and diminish their chances for survival.
On a second thought, I cannot take credit for such an efficient lobbying for Compassion with poor and basic Common Sense.
The full Coal lobbying credit goes to Nate Hagens who posted the graph above and Cutler Cleveland and C. Hall of US EIA who supplied the graph and underlying data.
If you had been following along, you'd know that the number for coal is mouth-of-the-mine and thus can't be directly compared with other sources on the graph.
Chris
China is already stumbling with king coal and they effectively have no restrictions. We have been exploiting coal for a very long time. Sure King coal will make something of a comeback as oil peaks but the transition from oil -> coal is not favorable even given electricity as a energy carrier. A move back to coal for the US does not result in a expanding economy we are not china. Without economic expansion our current way of life is dead.
If the situation is a declining or at best steady state economy with energy say taking 20-30% or more of economic output your dealing with a radically different economic landscape and set of economic forces vs today.
Put it this way simply to cover the liquid fuel needs for our global economy into say 2020 or so means we need coal to supply about 50mbd at least of liquid fuels not to mention expanded electrical needs. And this is assuming very conservative declines in oil production say 1-2%. Your free to consider almost any resource and even given anemic growth of 2% a year off our current base the requirements by 2020 are mind boggling. And this does not even include potential growth in the Middle East or Africa just India and China.
So its impossible to consider the business as usual scenario as valid and its more important to focus on smoothing the transition to a renewable society. Not that coal does not have a large role as a intermediate source of power during a transition but only as part of a bootstrap to renewable. CTL etc will simply eliminate our chances of getting out of this one without serious hardship. The window if you will of opportunity is rapidly closing the longer we ignore the basic resource/economic problems we face.
For some uses liquid fuels are very difficult to replace, for instance in some heavy equipment like agricultural machinery.
For others electricity can be substituted, and where it can is often enormously more efficient, for instance the entire car fleet in the US if run on electricity and batteries would only consume some 75GW or so of power.
The use of air source heat pumps alone could increase the efficiency of space heating with electricity by a factor of between 2.5 and 4, whilst residential solar thermal could provide most hot water needs.
Once we start getting on with it then a lot of substitutions can be made which greatly reduce the power requirements.
"For some uses liquid fuels are very difficult to replace, for instance in some heavy equipment like agricultural machinery."
It just takes a little creativity. For instance, see:
http://www.greencarcongress.com/2008/05/komatsu-to-begi.html#more
For more efficiency, the next step is a bigger battery and a plug...
Developing batteries capable of running massive pieces of mining equipment or giant combines for extended periods of time strikes me as non trivial problem. Also in the case of mining we will be faced with the necessity of running power lines to every remote mining site which I assume will jack up expenses, although these expenses would be offset in some degree by decreased expenses in the oil industry. Also I do not anticipate either ocean going vessels or airplanes running in a hybrid configuration any time soon.
I understand that in the case of mining much electrical equipment is used anyway.
You could power it either with nuclear battery technology or solar or wind.
Obviously if you used the renewables option then storage would have to be provided, so you could run the mine 24/7.
In discussions here agricultural machinery seemed to be a lot tougher, as it has got to be able to move around.
A rather rambling discussion came up with a couple of ideas such as a power truck to replenish the equipment, zinc-oxide batteries or making an exception by using biofuels, but nothing worked too well.
"Developing batteries capable of running massive pieces of mining equipment or giant combines for extended periods of time strikes me as non trivial problem. "
Mining is, as Davemart notes, often electrified already. Underground operations don't like fuel...
Combines are harder. You might have to have overhead lines, or swappable batteries. Either would be infinitely better than any alternative with draft animals, as we occasionally see proposed. I expect that we'll see hybrid machinery gradually expand their batteries and start plugging in, as batteries get cheaper.
"I do not anticipate either ocean going vessels or airplanes running in a hybrid configuration any time soon."
Planes are hard, due to their weight limits.
Water shipping is much, much easier. In fact, container vessels could easily run mostly on solar and wind, due to the very low power to surface ratios of these huge boats. Large batteries could be carried for the remainder, to be recharged at frequent port stops, as used to be done with coal. Or, the ships could just slow down - a speed reduction of 25% reduces power consumption by 50%.
If this is so easy, why don't we do it already? Because bunker fuel has been so cheap. Now, even at PV's currently high price points it would be cheaper than bunker fuel for propelling ships.